Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Nov. 3rd, 2016

[Lisa Bamford De Gante]

The three-year delay obviously poses hardships on families. A lot happens in three years. The families who are here are working and participating in our economy, and that's how they are able to apply for sponsorship.

Again, I emphasize that the cost of living here is not the same as the cost of living in MTV, Montreal, Toronto and Vancouver. Just as we don't.... When we bring in government-assisted refugees, they don't receive the same income in each province. It's based on the social assistance rates in that province, so I'm surprised that the minimum is a uniform national cut-off point.

Again, the family I was speaking of was able to do a sponsorship, but they had to wait until their income was raised to that level and then reapply. The previous speaker mentioned the cut-off rates, but they also depend obviously on the size of the family.

I do think they need to be regional. Our economies are regional. Our cost of living is regional, and our wages are regional.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

It sounds good. I guess we should look into this requirement.

Mr. Bissett, what do you think of the three years?

[James Bissett]

I would heartily agree that there should be regional differences. We know there are regional differences in income and it would only make sense.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Puneet, if I hear you correctly, you're saying it's 18 months' time for your wife to get here, but if we have some sort of a solution, such as, if she can come to the country with a visitor visa, is that acceptable?

[Puneet Uppal]

Yes, that's totally acceptable because I'm already approved as a sponsor. First, my file went to Mississauga. They took care of my income slips. I submitted all my T4s and my notice of assessment. I was approved within a week and that was in March. In March, I applied, and in April, I was approved, but my file has been sitting in New Delhi since April and the file hasn't moved yet. What I'm requesting is that during that waiting period, when I have qualified as a sponsor, my wife should be welcome to apply for a visitor visa, but right now, that's not the case. If you apply, you get rejected.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Lisa, do you have any thoughts on this one?

[Lisa Bamford De Gante]

I should also mention that in the delays in the sponsorship process, reading the application guidelines, many families early on think that because the process is tentatively approved, they do their medicals. We've seen that many families have had to do double medicals because the medical expires before their case is processed. In my own family, both my husband and my son had to do two medicals and we thought our daughter would need a third as well. There's a great cost to families who have been approved in principle. I think a previous question was regarding the application process and costs.

[The Chair, Liberal, Borys Wrzesnewskyj]

You have 20 seconds.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Mr. Bissett, do you want to add something?

[James Bissett]

In my day, as they say, right up until the 1990s, priority was given to spouses. If a husband came here on his own and then wanted to bring his wife, every effort was made to get her here quickly. The delay, again, is because of numbers, I'm afraid.

[The Chair, Liberal, Borys Wrzesnewskyj]

Thank you.

Ms. Zahid, you have five minutes, please.

[Salma Zahid, Liberal, Scarborough Centre, ON]

I want to thank the witnesses for providing their valuable input.

My first question is directed to Ms. Lisa Bamford De Gante.

One of the main categories for family reunification we are looking at is the parents and grandparents category. It has been said by some, largely without research or evidence to back it up, that this category is an economic drain on Canada. However, we have also heard from several academics, and just in the last session we heard from some people also that they have produced research that shows parents and grandparents make a positive economic contribution. When looking at their impact on the family as a whole, we see that the child care they provide allows both spouses to enter the workforce and pay taxes. We also heard that the average age of this category is younger than you would expect and most have another decade in the workforce when they arrive. When the parents and grandparents are back in the country of origin, oftentimes money is being sent back to support them, money that is leaving the Canadian economy, because in some cultures the children have to look after and support their parents.

Could you discuss the economic contribution the parents and grandparents can make that you have seen in your experience with the families you deal with?

[Lisa Bamford De Gante]

I definitely see the situations you've just spoken of, in which parents and grandparents make a huge contribution to child care, but also to cooking at home and having meals ready, given the long hours that many parents are working. Our notion of lifespan now is to 100, and we're looking at increased ages in the labour market for all of us. My own father is 80, an engineer, and doesn't plan to retire until he's unable to continue. My mother-in-law as well, at 80, is very active. She would be someone who would fit into the super visa category, going back and forth. I think she has a huge contribution to make to her grandchildren, maintaining the culture, and to our family's economy when she's here visiting just by maintaining our home life while we're out in the labour market. She's also very involved in the community, sharing her culture with other seniors and she really wants to contribute here, even as a visitor.

New Brunswick is the canary in the coal mine. Our country's average age is increasing. Atlantic Canada is seeing it first, but it's coming. The year 2030 is the year “Knowledge Matters” gave as to when all new population growth in the country would come through immigration.

We need to find ways to expedite the system. I've seen it work better. We're always told that we can't be sure of the delay in the secondary country, but sometimes the processing there is actually faster.

[Salma Zahid, Liberal, Scarborough Centre, ON]

My next question is for Mr. Bissett.

You mentioned that people above a certain age usually earn less than $15,000, but do you see that with their support, the income of the family, the unit, increases because a family has parents or grandparents living with them?

My next-door neighbours have three young daughters. Both husband and wife work because they have their parents with them. I have seen the grandmother dropping the kids off in the morning at school, picking them up for lunch, cooking for them, and taking them out for a walk. She is looking after them until sunset, when the mother comes back. Although she is not earning, she is making the income of that unit increase because, naturally, the mother wouldn't be able to work if she has to look after three daughters and she doesn't have the support of the grandmother.

What would you say on that?

[James Bissett]

I completely understand that, and that's happening in many, many thousands of cases. But the facts and the reality of it is, from these studies, which are authentic and are done by StatsCanada, and so on, in the case that you gave, the grandmother may be helping the parents go out and work, both of them, but at one point, the grandmother may have to go to hospital or she may acquire dementia and she has to get health care. That's what they're looking at. They're looking at the aggregate of what happens when parents and grandparents over the age of 65 come to Canada and they live for that 20-year period and what it's going to cost the taxpayers.

[The Chair, Liberal, Borys Wrzesnewskyj]

I'd like to thank the panel for their insights, and I would just like to make one request of Mr. Bissett.

You've referenced studies a number of times, in which this $300,000 figure is quantified. Could you please provide those studies to the committee as reference?

[James Bissett]

Yes. I have it here.

[The Chair, Liberal, Borys Wrzesnewskyj]

You've referenced several studies, so, if you could provide those, that would be of tremendous help for the committee as we do our work.

I would like to thank the panellists for their insights, as I said previously.

We will now suspend for one minute and go in camera to deal with committee business.

Thank you.

[Proceedings continue in camera]