Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Nov. 1st, 2022

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Good afternoon, everybody. I call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 39 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration. Today we will continue our study on application backlogs and processing times.

I would like to welcome our witnesses who are appearing before our committee today.

We are joined by Yves-Gérard Méhou-Loko, vice-president, and also Alain Dupuis, director general, for the Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada. Our second witness is Mr. Peter Bhatti, chairman, International Christian Voice. Our third witness for today is Shelley Gilbert, coordinator, social work services, representing Legal Assistance of Windsor.

Welcome to all the witnesses. You will have five minutes for your opening remarks.

We will start with Mr. Méhou-Loko, representing Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada.

The floor is yours. You have five minutes for your opening remarks.

[Yves-Gérard Méhou-Loko, Vice-President, Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Madam Chair, members of the committee, thank you for inviting us to appear before you today.

My name is Yves‑Gérard Méhou‑Loko, and I am the vice-president of the Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada, or FCFA for short. Joining me is Alain Dupuis, our director general.

The FCFA is the national voice of the 2.8 million members of Canada's French-speaking minority communities in nine provinces and three territories. For nearly five decades, the FCFA has been standing up for language rights and the French language. The FCFA also plays a leading role in immigration in French-speaking and Acadian communities.

In 2003, the government and francophone minority communities jointly set a 4.4% target for French-speaking immigrants to Canada outside Quebec by 2008. In 2006, however, the government announced that it was pushing the deadline 15 years into the future. One of the main reasons given by the government at the time was the considerable backlog of applications already in the system.

The government has never managed to make any significant progress towards the target, with francophone immigration stagnating below 2% for most of the past decade. Last year, the official languages commissioner estimated that francophone minority communities could have welcomed 76,000 more immigrants had the target been met as of 2008.

Express entry is the main tool for recruiting economic immigrants, but it wasn't designed to support francophone immigration. It's a general immigration program that was tweaked to take into account applicants' knowledge of French, but it has proven inadequate thus far.

At the bare minimum, express entry should include quotas for the selection of French-speaking immigrants. In addition, applications from French-speaking candidates should be assessed on their own, instead of being lumped together with general applications. Better still, the government should establish a separate economic immigration program tailored to the needs and realities of francophones.

Francophones are also being penalized for the lack of processing capacity for immigration applications in sub-Saharan Africa, particularly in relation to family class and student visa applications. A single office, in Dakar, Senegal, handles the applications from 16 countries. Last week's census figures show just how serious the problem is. Take the top 20 countries of origin of French-speaking immigrants who settle outside Quebec. Only two of the countries served by the Dakar visa office are on that list, the Democratic Republic of the Congo and Cameroon.

Given that sub-Saharan Africa is a massive pool of potential French-speaking immigrants, Canada can—and must—do a lot more. Additional offices are desperately needed in sub-Saharan Africa to process applications.

Canada has failed to reach its target for two decades, so 4.4% is no longer the right number. The demographic weight of Canada's francophone minority community will not be restored under that target.

In April, the FCFA called on the Government of Canada to adopt a catch‑up target. It would start at 12% beginning in 2024 and gradually increase to 20% by 2036. A measure like that would make it possible to repair the damage done by the stagnating level of francophone immigration since 2003, while putting communities on the path to growth.

Greater visa processing capacity in French-speaking countries, namely in sub-Saharan Africa, and the removal of visa barriers for international students are two essential steps to reach the catch‑up target.

Furthermore, specific francophone streams should be established for economic immigrants and family class immigrants, as well as for the provincial nominee programs and the refugee sponsorship support program.

Lastly, the government needs to support capacity building, so that communities can participate all along the francophone immigration continuum, from promotion and selection to settlement and integration.

Communities expect Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada to take concrete steps and actions, so that Canada can fulfill its francophone immigration commitment, as set out in the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act.

Thank you for this opportunity.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you.

We will now proceed to Mr. Bhatti, representing International Christian Voice. He's the chairman.

Mr. Bhatti, you can please begin. You will have five minutes for your opening remarks.

[Peter Bhatti, Chairman, International Christian Voice]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you for the opportunity to present our concerns as a sponsorship agreement holder with the private sponsorship program.

International Christian Voice, or ICV, is a registered, non-profit charitable human rights organization. Our core work is to assist individuals and families who have fled religious persecution and are stranded in third countries with little or no hope.

My family and I have personally suffered from religious persecution. My youngest brother, Shahbaz Bhatti, was the only Christian federal minister in the Government of Pakistan and was assassinated by religious extremists in March 2011.

Since 2016, ICV has submitted more than 100 sponsorship applications. The average waiting time for the completion of the sponsorship process has been three years or more. I want to give you an example.

One refugee family fled from their homeland due to religious persecution, in 2013, to Thailand. ICV submitted their file in April 2017. The family was called for an interview in September 2019. The case was refused in March 2020. The head of the family fell into depression and was involved in an accident in which he was killed. He left behind a young wife and four daughters. After the judicial review, upon reapplying, their application was accepted and his family came to Canada this year. The family suffered for nine years and lost the head of the family.

Here are our concerns.

Application backlogs and processing times are the major concern for the sponsorship agreement holders and for the refugees and asylum seekers, who continue to suffer while waiting for the processing of approvals. In our experience, most of the refugees and asylum seekers who have been persecuted for their faith are from low-income backgrounds, have very little education and lack effective communication skills. They are at a significant disadvantage when trying to effectively share their stories of persecution with the visa officers, which can lead to the refusal of their applications.

It appears that a lack of sufficient human resources may be the root cause of the delays today. Due to unexpected political crises, wars and natural disasters around the world, we see that the same human resources handling immigration cases are pulled to respond to the new crises. These delays put on hold the applications of those who are waiting their turn and are causing a massive backlog.

With regard to recommendations, we strongly request that a dedicated number of staff be appointed to handle PSR applications and other routine immigration activities. Pulling away resources or adding an additional workload on the staff should be prevented.

Visa officials should be introduced to and made reasonably aware of the culture, demographics and political and religious conflicts of the countries where refugees are coming from. Video recordings of interviews have verified that there are incorrect interpretations of conversations during interviews between visa officers and applicants.

We are grateful to the Canadian government for playing an important role on the world stage to assist refugees and asylum seekers. However, we, as sponsorship agreement holders, are facing many challenges with our applications, which is causing prolonged suffering and pain for those we are trying to help.

We would welcome a greater initiative by the government to address these issues as soon as possible. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you, Mr. Bhatti.

We will now proceed to Ms. Shelley Gilbert, coordinator for social work services, representing Legal Assistance of Windsor.

Ms. Gilbert, you will have five minutes for your opening remarks. You can please begin.

[Shelley Gilbert, Coordinator, Social Work Services, Legal Assistance of Windsor]

I would like to thank the members of the committee for the invitation to speak on this very important topic.

In preparation for today, I have both spoken with other service providers and reflected upon the experiences of the people I've had the privilege of working with.

Chairperson, the delays in processing through immigration offices, both in Canada and in our visa offices abroad, are having a dire effect on the mental health of families asking for our help.

Legal Assistance of Windsor is a legal aid-funded clinic, where social workers, social work students, lawyers and law students provide a range of services to our community. As a community heavily enriched by immigration over the past 50 years, we work closely with newcomers, migrant workers, survivors of human trafficking and refugee claimants on their settlement in Canada and in reuniting them with their families.

An issue I would like to raise today is the processing of dependent family members of protected persons. As of Friday, October 28, the average processing time for protected persons applying for permanent residence was 21 months. This 21 months is in addition to the time involved in the processing of refugee claims.

Essentially, families who have experienced violence and separate due to persecution are waiting years to be reunited through the immigration process. In the meantime, separated family members abroad often face the same danger that led their relatives to flee.

Of particular concern in my practice is the experience of women who have faced intimate partner violence and were forced to leave their children behind to seek safety. Facing extreme violence, women leave without their children due to custody issues, the inability to apply for passports or the limited resources available to women with children who are fleeing abusive partners and seeking safety.

During the years of status determination and the 21 months of permanent residence processing, children remain vulnerable to ongoing violence by the abusive partners or the extended family members. The delay provides the opportunity for abusers to use children to exert continuous coercive control over the victim. Fleeing to Canada has prevented physical violence from continuing, but delays in processing allow for psychological coercion and control to continue and, in some situations, for physical violence to be transferred from the mother to her children.

The anguish our clients experience creates additional strains on their capacity to restart their lives in Canada. Many contemplate returning to face their persecutors and protect their children. As you can imagine, others live with feelings of extreme guilt while awaiting the outcome of their applications. All struggle with the negative mental health effects of knowing their families are in danger. We cannot expect symptoms of trauma to lessen and heal when we know the people we love are experiencing the violence once perpetrated upon us.

The lasting damage to relationships cannot always be repaired, leading to higher rates of divorce and separation. Children, especially those who were separated during the developing years and who have witnessed or experienced abuse, often have difficulties in forming lasting relationships with their families after arrival. The trauma of violence and the extended delays in obtaining safety are impacting the mental health of two generations.

What is so disheartening is that many of the administrative delays are unnecessary. Our clients have been asked to provide duplicate forms in addition to the forms filled out by the principal applicant in Canada. Extended security screenings for principal applicants delay the issuing of permanent resident visas for children who would not be subject to such security screenings anyway.

The limited options available to separated families, such as a temporary resident permit, are rarely available. Visa officers continue to refuse such applications, despite evidence of immediate dangers posed to separated family members, even to children living in their own country of origin. In many cases, visa officers still consider lack of family ties in the country of origin as a deciding criteria in refusing a visitor visa, even where clear evidence of humanitarian considerations is provided.

We recommend that this committee consider, under Canada's humanitarian obligations, the effect such policies have on families. As a country that prides itself on understanding the importance of mental health for a productive and fair society, we ask that unnecessary delays—delays negatively impacting the mental health of refugees and their families—be removed.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you, Ms. Gilbert.

We will proceed to our first round of questioning. We will begin with Mr. Redekopp.

Mr. Redekopp, you have six minutes for your round of questioning. Please begin.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you to our witnesses for being here today.

I'm going to start with the Fédération des communautés francophones. You mentioned student visas, and I know that there are problems with the post-graduate work program. The government tried to place a band-aid on the program a few months ago with the announcement of an extension of some work permits, but this past Friday I put an Order Paper question into the House of Commons, trying to get to the bottom of why certain post-grads were specifically excluded.

Do you agree that the Liberal government should not be specifically excluding any post-graduate work students at a time when we need these workers?

[Yves-Gérard Méhou-Loko]

Thank you for your question, Mr. Redekopp.

We are aware of the problems certain immigration applicants are experiencing right now. We know the government needs to do better and do more. We expect all of Canada's elected officials to speak out about the situation and take the necessary steps so that the visa applications of foreign students in Canada are processed and granted in a timely fashion.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Thank you.

I want to turn now to Mr. Bhatti. Thank you for the work that International Christian Voice is doing in bringing persecuted Christian minorities to Canada. In my own riding of Saskatoon West, Canadian Aid to Persecuted Christians, which is run by your relative Nadeem Bhatti, is doing similar work, and I also want to thank him and his organization.

Helping Christians is not one of those things that get you front-page headlines in the Toronto media elite or praised by gatekeepers or woke folks, but there are still various terrorist organizations like the Taliban, the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps, Hamas and others that murder Christian minorities every day. Your own brother, you mentioned, was murdered.

International Christian Voice now sponsors refugees in Canada. We've heard from the Saskatoon and Toronto Catholic dioceses that there are issues with this process at the Immigration Canada level and at the United Nations High Commission for Refugees level.

Regarding groups like Christian minorities, have you experienced specific problems with the UNHCR, and is there something that Canada should do to fix those?

[Peter Bhatti]

Thank you so much.

Yes, there is a problem with the UNHCR especially, as I mentioned here. When religious minorities apply for immigration through UNHCR to seek asylum in Canada, they are less educated and they cannot present their cases properly. UNHCR wants to have 100% of the evidence, which the applicants fail to do because of their situation in Pakistan and how they are persecuted there.

Also there is biased decision-making by the interpreters about visas. When they are doing the interpretation for our community members, those who are applying for asylum, they do not interpret properly and the result is that our cases are being refused.

I have a friend who just came from Thailand. He witnessed how refugees being questioned by the UNHCR have said, “I can speak English. I want to give evidence in English,” and they have been told, “No, no. If you interrupt us, you will have two more years' delay.” That kind of thing is happening every day and it causes our cases to be refused.

Unfortunately, when our Canadian visa officers want to go for an interview, they first see the files brought from the UNHCR. Most of the things there are making a decision to see files, but UNHCR is making the decisions about those files. That is the cause of more refusals.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Just so I understand, what you're saying is that the interpreters at the UNHCR are biased sometimes against certain minorities like Christians, for example.

[Peter Bhatti]

Yes.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

That's essentially what you're saying.

Interviews aren't always recorded. Do you think it would be a good thing for those interviews to be recorded all the time?

[Peter Bhatti]

That would be helpful, especially when we apply for judicial review or anything else to appeal the case. That would help a lot to justify that either the refugee has a problem or the interpreter has a problem or the visa officer gave a wrong decision.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

A lot of the cases from Pakistan are dealt with in Singapore. I'm just curious as to whether you have any information on the Singapore IRCC office regarding this issue of bias and minority Christians.

[Peter Bhatti]

In the last few years, we've had several refusal cases from the Singapore office, especially people from Christian minorities. We have appealed several times to IRCC, and I think IRCC is looking at that.

It is a little bit better, but still, it needs to be focused more on these issues.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Do you have more examples of people who have been failed by this process?

[Peter Bhatti]

Yes. There is one application that was refused recently from IRCC. The guy was a target of the extremists in Karachi, and he went to the hospital. He went through the crisis, but unfortunately because of the circumstances, it did not allow him to give all the evidence, a police report or the hospital report.

Because, Madam Chair and also other honourable MPs, from Pakistan, once a person is accused, especially for the blasphemy law or other cases, they have no space. They are hiding day and night and they cannot produce the proper evidence. Due to that lack of evidence, they are deemed failed. They have never accepted that there is a problem when somebody is accused due to this kind of blasphemy law or other religious persecution, and they have no place anywhere.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting, but time is up.

We will now proceed to Ms. Kayabaga.

Ms. Kayabaga, you will have six minutes for your round of questioning. You can please begin.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I would like to start by thanking and welcoming all of our witnesses who have come to speak to us today.

I will address my questions to Monsieur Méhou-Loko.

Good afternoon, Mr. Méhou‑Loko.

I'm going to do this quickly so I can get in all of my questions.

Today, the minister, Mr. Fraser, announced new measures to welcome to Canada up to 500,000 people in 2025, and even more after that.

In your opening remarks, you said the 4.4% target for francophone immigration to Canada outside Quebec was insufficient.

What measure do you wish the minister had announced? You don't think 4.4% of 500,000 people in 2025 is enough, so what would be the right target?

[Yves-Gérard Méhou-Loko]

As far as the immigration target goes, the FCFA has repeatedly underscored the need to significantly increase francophone immigration levels and to adopt a catch-up target. The government has never managed to achieve the 4.4% target to date, which explains why the deadline has been pushed back so many times.

Today, what we want is a catch-up target, which would restore the levels of Canada's francophones and, above all, their demographic weight, power and existence, ensuring the survival of French-speaking communities. It's important to point out that Canada's francophone community is part of the country's identity, so we feel strongly that these measures should be taken.

We want to see a 12% target for 2024, increasing to 20% of immigration by 2036. That would give back the francophone community its demographic power.

I will ask our director general to comment on what Mr. Fraser announced today. We had an opportunity to examine what has been done and what was introduced today by the minister. I'll let Mr. Dupuis—

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Before Mr. Dupuis takes the floor, can you tell us what you think of Bill C-13? That study has been dragging on at the Standing Committee on Official Languages. The bill could help strengthen all the measures and targets you talked about today.

[Yves-Gérard Méhou-Loko]

You used the word “dragging”, and that is precisely how we see it.

As we go about our daily lives, we, francophones, have been waiting for Canada's elected officials to vote on and pass Bill C-13, which somewhat bolsters the gains made by francophone communities but, above all, ensures their survival.

Today, our situation is desperate. As we, at the FCFA, recently demonstrated ourselves, our organizations are really struggling. French-speaking organizations are not doing well, and they are the ones—let's not forget—that provide services to francophone communities today. That's why it's so important for those organizations to receive immediate support and for the bill to be passed as soon as possible. The federal government and community partners will then be able to provide assistance to communities and ensure their survival.

You said that the study of Bill C‑13 was dragging on. Yes, it's taking a long time. We are rather tired of waiting. We would like to see the process reach a successful conclusion as soon as possible. Once again, we urge the honourable members to hear their fellow Canadians and francophones and to move this bill forward without delay.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

You mentioned the need to open more visa offices. I assume you know about the new visa office in Yaoundé. What are your thoughts on that? What improvements would you say are needed?