Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Nov. 1st, 2022

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting, but the time is up for Mr. Kmiec.

We will now proceed to Mr. El-Khoury.

Mr. El-Khoury, you will have four minutes for your round of questioning. You can begin, please.

[Fayçal El-Khoury, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'd like to welcome the witnesses.

Mr. Désir, how do you feel about the tool for selecting applicants on economic grounds?

Could you tell us more about that?

[Saint-Phard Désir]

Of course, it's a very good thing to be able to pick and choose people who can come to this country for economic reasons and find jobs quickly. The problem is that employers need people right away, not in 10 days from now. So we need to find a way to speed up application processing so that employers can get people when they need them. We were told it would take about four weeks to four months, but it's taking more than eight months. By that time, employers are already discouraged and they move on.

It's great to have systems in place to bring people into the country to start working right away, but the application processing time needs to be sped up.

[Fayçal El-Khoury, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

I listened carefully to your speech. I'd like to know, what's the main thing you'd like to see included in the documents you mentioned?

[Saint-Phard Désir]

In my opinion, these are the important things...

We need more immigrants from French-speaking countries, especially in Africa. For that we'll need more visa offices.

We must also facilitate foreign student applications by no longer asking them to prove that they will return home after their studies, since our goal is for them to stay here after their studies.

[Fayçal El-Khoury, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

Thank you.

I'd now like to address Ms. Schemitsch.

For clarification, Ms. Schemitsch, I would like to make it clear for you that the increasing demand in applicants is not the same. In 2015, we had 270,000 applications. In 2022, we have 431,000 applications, and that explains clearly why we have more resources. Thank you.

In a March article, you were in favour of authorizing emergency travel between Canada and Ukraine.

Can you tell us more about those measures and how you justified them in spite of the backlogs and processing delays?

[Laura Schemitsch]

I believe that those circumstances were very dire, so those measures came into place in order to facilitate helping people during a humanitarian crisis, as Canada has done in the past. I believe that I was also critical of the fact that those measures have not been extended to other communities and other people of different nationalities. It is a complicated question, and I don't believe that—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting, but the time is up for Mr. El-Khoury.

We will proceed to Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe for two minutes.

Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, please begin.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Mr. El‑Khoury has just inspired me.

Ms. Schemitsch, you haven't been doing this job for very long—that's what you stated earlier—but you do have some experience with IRCC.

As we know, we're going to be facing more and more international crises, whether it's climate change or major armed conflicts. Did you find this had a direct impact on processing backlogs?

During the Afghan crisis, for example, 15 to 25% of IRCC staff were focused on that one crisis alone. Did you feel that on the ground, as an immigration lawyer?

[Laura Schemitsch]

Can you please clarify your question?

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Yes.

When an international crisis such as the Afghan crisis happens, do you feel that backlogs at IRCC and for all other programs increase because IRCC officers are focused on that one crisis alone?

As an immigration lawyer, do you see that happening during an international crisis?

[Laura Schemitsch]

My understanding is that it does occur, and I believe that other colleagues of mine in the immigration bar have suggested that perhaps IRCC should have an emergency task force that is able to deal with those special circumstances that undoubtedly will arise in the future, while not taking away resources from our everyday programs that need to properly function moving forward and to absolutely continue to tackle this backlog.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you.

In fact, I had even suggested an emergency plan to the government. However, I never heard back from the minister.

That said, I guess it's going to happen, because more and more people are saying that the department needs to have emergency measures to be able to respond to an international crisis.

Do I have any time left, Madam Chair?

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Time is up.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

I'd like to thank all the witnesses for being here today.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

We will now proceed to Ms. Kwan.

Ms. Kwan, you have two minutes for your round of questioning. Please go ahead.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

My question is for Mr. Désir.

The issues are systemic racism within IRCC, the processing delays and a variety of other issues, not the least of which is the government missing the targets for francophone immigrants to Canada. Given that this is the state of play, do you think the Canadian government should put in place an independent ombudsperson to look at all of these problems and issues and to make recommendations for government to take action?

[Saint-Phard Désir]

I believe it's always a good idea to have an ombudsperson. However, I can't prove that these delays are due to racism rather than existing regulations.

For example, international students are told that the reason they're being rejected is because they are not providing proof that they will return to their country, regardless of their country of origin.

In my view, it's not necessarily racism, but we're also not walking the talk here. We're telling them to come study in Canada so that they can stay in Canada.

When it comes to the permanent resident application processing backlog, in my opinion, the major problem is that there aren't enough visa offices.

In any event, it would not be a bad thing to have an ombudsperson.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Yes. On the issue around racism and discrimination, we learned from the other study that a number of different factors are in play, including immigration policies that bias against individuals from certain countries, because inherently the requirements for them to prove that they will return to their country of origin are heightened and increased. To address that systemic issue, something needs to be done if we want to bring equalization to that question. Of course, that would be a thing that I think an independent ombudsperson would or should look into—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting, Ms. Kwan. Your time is up.

The time is up for this panel. On behalf of all the members of this committee, I want to thank all the witnesses for appearing before the committee. If there is something you would like to bring to the notice of the members and you were not able to discuss because of the time, you can always send a written submission to the clerk of the committee. We will take that into consideration as we go through the draft report.

For the information of members, our next meeting will take place on Friday. We will complete the draft report consideration of differential outcomes. At the request of the analyst, we will have to use version three, because it can be very confusing to follow that. To make sure we complete that on Friday, please go through version three and be ready. We will be going through version three of the report.

With that, the meeting is adjourned. We'll see you all on Friday.