Citizenship and Immigration Committee on June 5th, 2023

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Thanks. I would appreciate that.

Does the department have numbers on how many people have become citizens, have sworn their citizenship and have been outside the country at that time?

[Nicole Girard]

I don't have that information to hand. I would have to check if that's something that we track, because it would be outside of the norm. I will take that back, and if there are statistics available, I will endeavour to obtain them and provide them to the committee at the earliest opportunity.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you, Ms. Girard.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Thank you. I appreciate that.

It seems like something that the department should know. As you said, it probably doesn't happen too frequently, so I would think that's something that would be known. I would appreciate having that sent.

Just before I go on, Madam Chair, the TV behind me is on. The sound is on. Is it possible to turn off the sound from the chamber?

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

We can see if we can do that.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

I like listening to the chamber myself.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Please go ahead, Mr. Redekopp.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

I have good hearing.

Ms. Girard, on the subject of wait times, because you had talked about wait times, I guess the reasoning that I'm picking up on here is the departmental reasoning that having these alternate methods is to speed up the process. Because this is something that's being demanded by people asking for this option, do you have statistics and have there been studies done on the requests to do that?

[Nicole Girard]

I can say in general that the department frequently receives representation from applicants who are looking to have their processing time reduced, and that is something that we continue to work hard to do. As I mentioned in a previous hearing, we had a record number of over 374,000 citizenship grants last year, but we have more work to do, including continuing to work on getting those processing times down.

In further response to the member's question about wait times and ceremonies, historically it's been in the range of three to five months. It can go as low as one to two months to wait to get your ceremony, and I believe it's on the lower end of the wait currently, but that can vary depending on the year and the demand and so on.

Part of this proposal is to again give the choice and put the applicants in the driver's seat in terms of what's going to work for them. If they're able to attend that ceremony, they wish to take their oath at a ceremony and they're prepared to do that, they can proceed. If they need to become citizens now and want to take an oath online, if that becomes an option that's available to them, they can do that and can become citizens immediately once the oath is taken, but still have the benefit of taking in that ceremony or participating in that ceremony without having a wait time.

Thank you.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Thanks. I appreciate that.

I guess the real question I was asking was this: Have people been asking for these options? I understand that it seems like it might be a good idea to people in the department, but have people been asking for the option to do it that way?

[Nicole Girard]

I'm not aware of all of the client feedback the department receives, so while it's possible that the request has been made, I don't have that information available to me at this time.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

It seems that if a quite significant policy shift like that was being done, there would be a lot of data to back that up.

Here's another way of asking that question then. Is there data to back up the reasoning for this decision, or is this just people sitting around a table who thought it would be a good idea and they thought they should do that?

[Nicole Girard]

This is an evidence-based proposal. It's backed by significant data. The data includes that the processing standard that the department strives to meet is to process citizenship applications within 12 months. Although the department achieved a record number of grants last year—over 374,000, as I mentioned—last April the processing times were around 27 months. Through hard work, those processing times continue to come down, but are still much higher than we want them to be. They are in the range of 21 or 22 months, as I understand it.

It's not an issue where the department needs to wait for specific service improvements to be received. We are constantly looking for opportunities for how to improve service offerings and client service, and how we can leverage technology to reduce processing times and wait times. We are confident that significant progress will continue with the various initiatives we've put in place over the last year or two during the pandemic, including bringing applications online, conducting online citizenship tests and having a combination of in-person citizenship ceremonies and virtual ones.

As the members heard, we will continue to see processing times go down, but we know we have work to do and that the service needs to improve. This is a proposal, among other initiatives that are under way, that is intended to do that.

Thank you.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Did I hear you say that the wait time for citizenship piece is 22 months? Is that correct?

[Nicole Girard]

Yes, that is correct.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

I understand that COVID-19 threw a monkey wrench into things.

What were wait times like in 2019 for citizenship?

[Nicole Girard]

I believe they were closer to the 12-month processing standard, but as I don't have that processing time in front of me now, we will check and provide that to the committee.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

I understand that you don't have that information and this might have come a little out of left field, so—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

If I can interrupt, Mr. Redekopp, can you please keep your comments related to the amendment we have on the floor? These are not related to that.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

I believe they are. This has to do with the system of online clicking for citizenship. I believe that is exactly what we are talking about here. It's the process by which the department has sought to implement this system, so I think these are very relevant questions to that point.

We are proposing that we shouldn't be doing that. That is what our amendment is basically saying. The department is actually providing a lot of information on why that might not be the case.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Keep your comments related to the amendment we have on the floor.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Okay.

On the wait time for ceremonies, I'm confused as to why the department feels it needs to make this change in order to get back to the processing standard. Let's say it was roughly on-standard in 2019 and prior. There were no online citizenship tests or there were no “click” citizenship abilities at that time.

Why does the department not believe it can get back to that point without using different technology like this?

[Nicole Girard]

Thank you for the question.

The department is constantly striving to improve processing times and to improve client service and accessibility, as I mentioned. Historically, the wait time for a ceremony, once the applicants had completed all the other requirements, was in the range of three to five months.

This is a proposal where the applicant does not elect to complete their oath at a ceremony as they do now, as I mentioned, but elects instead to complete their oath online. Once that oath is completed online, they become a citizen. They no longer have to wait the three to five months to attend the ceremony, but they still have the benefit of being able to participate in that ceremony at the later date.

In a sense, you can describe that as win-win, in that there is greater accessibility and flexibility. The applicant has an option to become a citizen at a earlier point in time, but still enjoy all of the benefits of participating in a ceremony, in terms of all of the important elements of that for inclusion, community participation and those kinds of considerations.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

That's kind of new to me, I guess. What you're saying is that, in the department's proposal, if you were to click your citizenship, you can still attend an in-person ceremony.

[Nicole Girard]

That's correct.