Citizenship and Immigration Committee on March 1st, 2022

[Sukh Dhaliwal, Liberal, Surrey—Newton, BC]

Madam Chair, it's not only the Liberal members who are concerned about the security. I'm not going to repeat what my other colleagues on the Liberal side have said, but it's my understanding that the Ukrainian Canadian Congress is also concerned about bad people coming to Canada if there is a visa-free entry.

I personally would suggest that members of the opposition reconsider, because the security and safety of Canadians are of utmost importance. This is not going to go well, so please consider that and do not support this motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you, Mr. Dhaliwal.

Mr. Hallan, go ahead.

[Jasraj Singh Hallan, Conservative, Calgary Forest Lawn, AB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Look, I think we're all concerned about security. There is no doubt.

Mr. El-Khoury had some really good points, and so did Mrs. Lalonde.

There is always going to be the question or the threat of a Russian sympathizer who could be there, but the way things are right now, I believe that they do check if someone is a threat to Canada, whether it is visa-free travel or not. I believe that's the way it is. There is an element of “Is that person going to be a Canadian threat?”

What we're doing here is proposing, given the situation, what we want to see the government do. Whatever decision the officials make with the minister, however that looks, whether they think the biometrics need to be done, whether they think that should be done before that person gets here or when they're here, I still think that's a decision they should make.

Right now I think what we're doing, in the spirit of trying to help the situation any way we can, is proposing this so that it can be taken into consideration by the officials and the government. I think we're all on the same page. That security threat is something that's serious, and I think everyone understands that part.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Monsieur Brunelle-Duceppe, go ahead.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Madam Chair, I would just like to reassure my colleagues.

Naturally, I take security issues very seriously. On that score, I'm in agreement with my colleague Ms. Lalonde. It's important to be very careful.

Today, there are many European countries whose citizens do not need a visa to come to Canada. Might there not be a large number of pro-Russian sympathizers in these countries? They could come to Canada without a visa, but as my colleague just said, there are security checks even when a visa is not required. I just want everyone to be aware of this. That's the first thing.

There was also discussion about the Ukrainian community. Notwithstanding the respect I have for our colleague Mr. Dhaliwal, I understand that some members of this community are somewhat fearful, but there are also many other countries asking us to suspend the visa requirement speedily, but only for the duration of the conflict, of course. We are all naturally hoping that it will end sooner rather than later, but we are not asking for a complete suspension of the visa requirement.

I don't know whether you've noticed, but something else has come into play, which is that Ukraine is going to apply to join the European Union. That would make it a member of the European community. If Ukraine were to be accepted, how could we require that citizens of one particular country in the European Union need a visa while citizens of other countries in the European Union do not?

All of that needs to be taken into consideration. I understand that it's a sensitive matter, but I think that we are all capable of coming to an agreement fairly quickly. I would nevertheless like to assure my colleagues that I too, not surprisingly, have concerns about security issues. However, I believe I've given you a few arguments on behalf of our request to suspend the visa requirement for Ukrainians affected by the conflict, but only for the duration of that conflict.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you.

Ms. Kwan, go ahead.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

I just want to highlight this point as well, as indicated by other committee members. It is certainly not the case that New Democrats are not concerned about security. Of course we are, and of course we want to ensure that Canadians are also protected.

We should also keep in mind that visa-free travel for Ukraine is being adopted by over 140 countries, most recently by Ireland. Does that mean those other countries and Ireland are not concerned about their security? Of course not. There are other measures that could be put in place, but time is of the essence right now with this situation. People's lives are at risk.

I have to tell you that my constituent, whose grandmother is 80 years old, had their visa application rejected two years ago. They are desperate to get out of the country to reunite with their loved ones and to be safe.

This is why visa-free travel is absolutely essential at this point in time. It is essential to facilitate and expedite this process. This is what we have to do to support the people of Ukraine at this juncture.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Mr. El-Khoury, I have you on the list.

[Fayçal El-Khoury, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

Madam Chair, I believe that the Canadian government and the people of Canada are helping Ukrainians who are caught up in this situation in every way possible, from both the military and humanitarian standpoints. As a government and as a people, we are prepared to continue to make a greater effort than any other country in the world.

But it's impossible for us to understand all of the risks involved in such a decision. It's much better to leave it to the appropriate officials with the required experience, whether at the Department of Public Safety or the Department of Immigration. We need to let them assess the situation and determine whether they can speed up the visa process for all these people, provided that our safety and security are maintained.

I believe that the responsible officials know what to do and that they are prepared to cooperate with these people and give them the help they are requesting.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you, Mr. El-Khoury.

Next we have Ms. Kayabaga, and then Mr. Redekopp.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Madam Chair, I wanted to propose a subamendment to the subamendment. I don't know if that's possible.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Process-wise, that's not possible. We cannot have a sub-subamendment. It stops at subamendment until we vote on the subamendment, and then you can propose another subamendment. We cannot propose any further amendment to the subamendment.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Can there be a friendly amendment to this?

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

If there is unanimous consent from the committee, there can be a friendly amendment, but there cannot be a sub-subamendment.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

What I was trying to propose is an expedited simplified visa process that would allow people to come, but would also ensure verifying security, which would work with what they're proposing but in a way that the security piece is still there.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Ms. Kayabaga is proposing a friendly amendment, so if we have consent from all the members, it can go ahead, but we cannot have a sub-subamendment. Right now we have a subamendment, so we cannot have another “sub” to it.

Do all the members agree with the friendly amendment proposed by Ms. Kayabaga?

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Can I hear the text one more time, Madam Chair, please?

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Ms. Kayabaga, can you please repeat what you are proposing as a friendly amendment?

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Yes, I'm proposing an expedited and simple way to process the visas, but with a level of security involved. That would be the friendly amendment. I don't know if Jasraj.... I don't know what you think.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

I have a point of order, Madam Chair.

It makes sense in principle, I think, but we need to see the text before we can say we're comfortable with that.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

It's a friendly amendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Ms. Kayabaga, I would propose you send this.

Let's deal with the subamendment first, and then maybe you can propose a subamendment once we vote on this subamendment. Meanwhile, you can send it to the clerk.

First of all, let's deal with the subamendment.

Mr. Dhaliwal, go ahead.

[Sukh Dhaliwal, Liberal, Surrey—Newton, BC]

Madam Chair, as Mr. Genuis has said, why don't we just...? It's easy to work with consensus, so if Ms. Kayabaga can send that amendment quickly, it can be incorporated and things can work more cordially. I'm sure Ms. Kwan is also waiting for her amendment.

Let's do this—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you, Mr. Dhaliwal.

Would all the members agree that we wait until Ms. Kayabaga can send her friendly amendment to the subamendment?

I think everyone is in agreement with that, so we will wait for Ms. Kayabaga to send it to the clerk.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Madam Chair, while that is going on, I'm embarrassed to admit this, but I realize I made a small grammatical error with my original amendment. In order to flow properly, it should say at the beginning of (c) “call on the Government of Canada to”, because otherwise it doesn't make perfect sense. It says “We...implement visa-free travel from Ukraine to Canada”, which we obviously can't do.

While we wait for that, if we can by unanimous consent undo my error and add that in, I would be very grateful.