Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Nov. 2nd, 2023

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

I call the meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 81 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration. Today, we are returning to our study of the government's response to the final report of the Special Committee on Afghanistan.

For the first hour, I'm pleased to welcome two officials from the Department of National Defence. They are Major-General Greg Smith, director general of international security policy; and Major-General Paul Prévost, director of staff, strategic joint staff.

Major-Generals, welcome to both of you.

They have a request. The witnesses want to have a hard stop at 4:30 p.m.

You will each have five minutes to deliver your remarks. Please, go ahead.

[Major-General Greg Smith, Director General, International Security Policy, Department of National Defence]

Mr. Chair and members of the committee, thank you for the invitation to appear today to update you on the government's response to the final report of the Special Committee on Afghanistan.

As was stated, I'm Major-General Greg Smith. I am the director general of international security policy at the Department of National Defence. In this regard, I'm responsible for managing and strengthening Canada's international bilateral and multilateral defence relationships.

I am joined by Major-General Paul Prévost, director of the strategic joint staff. Major-General Prévost advises the chief of the defence staff on Canadian Armed Forces operations and is responsible for interdepartmental coordination for operations where the Canadian Armed Forces support a federal effort.

Turning to the special committee's report on Afghanistan, National Defence is implicated in recommendations one, two and 18.

Recommendation 1 calls for the government to re‑examine the lessons from our mission in Afghanistan and apply those in future planning and response. Throughout Operation Aegis—our evacuation mission in Afghanistan—National Defence worked closely with Global Affairs, Immigration and 13 allies to evacuate Canadian citizens and Afghan nationals, providing strategic airlift capabilities to help bring them to safety.

The Canadian Armed Forces provided these capabilities in a volatile environment, and we contributed to an international air-bridge that allowed the evacuation of approximately 3,700 individuals from Kabul. Following the operation, we conducted reviews to identify areas for improvement in relevant policies, programs and operations. These reviews reinforced the importance of such close coordination among partners.

National Defence is applying these lessons in ongoing operations, such as our support for non-combatant evacuations from Israel. Indeed, National Defence is ensuring the logistical feasibility and safety of these evacuations through collaboration with local, regional and international allies and partners.

Recommendation two of the report stressed that, during crises, interdepartmental coordination must be established rapidly to respond effectively. Interdepartmental coordination is constant in the federal government. National Defence participates in regular coordination meetings at the deputy minister, assistant deputy minister, director general and working levels. Ad hoc meetings are convened when a crisis is unfolding or seems imminent.

Recommendation 18 concerns our support to federal efforts to assist those who supported Canada's mission in Afghanistan. We are collaborating with Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada to help resettle 40,000 eligible Afghans by the end of 2023 by assessing whether applicants or their families had a significant relationship with National Defence.

We are proud of what the CAF accomplished in Afghanistan and are implementing the report's recommendations in all activities to the greatest extent possible.

I look forward to your questions. Thank you for your time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you, Major-General Smith. Your timing was excellent.

I'll be very strict with my time today when I keep the clock.

First, we'll go to the Honourable Michelle Rempel Garner for six minutes.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Thank you, Chair.

Major-General Smith and Major-General Prévost, thank you for your service and thank you for being here today.

As part of our study on Operation Aegis and the evacuation of Afghanistan, there were some significant irregularities that came to light regarding the issuance of template visa documents and facilitation letters via Senator Marilou McPhedran.

I am wondering if any one of you, or your broader staff, authorized Mr. George Young, the former Liberal chief of staff to the minister, to issue template visa documents to Senator McPhedran.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Major-General Smith or Major-General Prévost, please go ahead.

[MGen Greg Smith]

Chair, I think the director of staff would like to respond to that, if it's okay.

[Major-General Paul Prévost, Director of Staff, Strategic Joint Staff, Department of National Defence]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

We're aware of those allegations. Based on those allegations, we've done an internal review at National Defence and the Canadian Armed Forces. No officials inside the defence department or the Canadian Armed Forces were involved in the production or the transmission of facilitation letters.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Thank you.

Were any of your staff aware that Mr. Young had sent this document to Senator McPhedran?

[MGen Paul Prévost]

Through our internal review, Mr. Chair, none of our staff was aware of any facilitation letters being produced.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Are you aware of any mechanisms that would be in place for someone like Mr. Young, a ministerial staff member, to issue official government documents to senators to use in this situation?

[MGen Paul Prévost]

Mr. Chair, I'm not aware of any process in that regard.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Did any of your staff receive any formal notification or any official communications when Mr. Young issued the document to the senator?

[MGen Paul Prévost]

Mr. Chair, we didn't receive anything. We only found out, months after, through those allegations, that facilitation letters may have been provided.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

You did mention that you went through an exercise to undertake lessons learned and best practices. Unfortunately, I think this situation requires best practices. I find it unfortunate that there haven't been any consequences levelled. I know that's not within your staff's purview.

Have you provided any advice to the government on things like tightening up protocols to ensure that type of communication between ministerial staff and third parties, in terms of issuing government documents, won't happen again?

[MGen Paul Prévost]

With regard to facilitation letters and the process employed during Operation Aegis, it probably would be for Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada to look into those processes. I think the processes inside government to ensure that there's a proper separation between the political staff and the officials are in place.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Thank you.

For me, I do have a concern that what happened in that circumstance could have put Canada's armed forces, the people who are serving, at risk, given the potential lack of security screening and whatnot.

Has your staff, as part of your review, flagged any concerns in this regard to the government or provided any potential measures to be put in place to ensure this doesn't happen again?

[MGen Paul Prévost]

In the case of this operation, I'm not going to speculate on the security of our forces on the sole fact that a facilitation letter may have been provided. For that operation, it was very fluid on the ground. As long as IRCC had a name to give us and the person presenting themselves around Hamid Karzai airport was on the list that was provided by IRCC, those were the people we let through. I'm not too sure how the facilitation letters played into that system. The people we let through the gate and let through all the way to another location were all vetted by IRCC.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Would you suggest that having security screening measures in place to ensure the safety of all personnel involved would be a prudent recommendation for this committee to make in terms of future operations?

[MGen Paul Prévost]

That's a good question, actually. That's exactly what we do.

Right now, as you're aware, we're very involved in the crisis in the Middle East. There have been other instances, for instance in Sudan last year, where we had to evacuate Canadian citizens and members of embassies. The security protocols are in place, coordinated by the security agencies, IRCC and Global Affairs, to ensure that the members who get on Canadian Armed Forces airplanes for further movement are all vetted by our security system.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

I guess there's just a bit of dissonance between the statement you just made and the previous one saying, in the case of Operation Aegis, that it was fluid and that you were relying on IRCC to do some of the screening.

Where does the buck stop right now in terms of screening? Is it IRCC or you? What sorts of mechanisms are in place to ensure there's information sharing and adequate...? It just seems like there's a bit of a gap between those two statements.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Major-General, you have 30 seconds to respond.

[MGen Paul Prévost]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'll try to do this quickly.

Aegis was very different from any other situation we had faced before. I think people will remember how the situation was dire in Afghanistan. We had an end date to get as many Afghans as possible out of harm's way with no intent to return to the country. Every measure we could take, with some mitigation put in place to allow those Afghans to make it to the airplanes, was taken with a bit of risk, obviously. HKIA in Afghanistan was a very risky place to operate. We're very proud of all the work that was done there.

Since then, all the evacuations we've done for Canadians have been in accordance with all the procedures we have in place among CBSA, CSIS and everybody involved in the vetting process of Canadians. The Canadian Armed Forces can make sure that, for the person who gets on board a Canadian Armed Forces airplane, their name comes from the proper agency to do that. We do not do any vetting inside the Canadian Armed Forces.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you, honourable member.

It's 6:30, so I will go to the Liberals. We have Mrs. Zahid for six minutes.

Please go ahead.

[Salma Zahid, Liberal, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Major-General Prévost and Major-General Smith, for appearing before the committee today.

As of October 27, Canada welcomed 40,415 Afghan refugees to Canada under all streams. As the IRCC minister told our committee last week in response to my question, that job is not done as of yet.

I would note that 2,635 Afghans have arrived in Canada under the pathway for extended family members of former interpreters. I would also like you to further know that 20,000 applications have been received through the special immigration measures program for the ones who assisted the Government of Canada, with 13,520 applications approved and 12,065 having arrived here in Canada.

I believe many in both of these categories would have connections to DND. Are you tracking those people who assisted the CAF in Afghanistan and those who wish to come to Canada? What is the situation for those who have not yet arrived?

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Major-Generals, the floor is yours.

Please go ahead.