Citizenship and Immigration Committee on April 20th, 2026

[Ted Gallivan]

I would describe the prior approach as more reactive and as acting on an exceptions basis if they thought there was a problem. I would also describe the amount of time. It was an annual process versus acting before the person's visa expired. I would say that both the timeliness and the thoroughness weren't where they needed to be.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

The reality is that the department didn't pay a lot of attention to whether people were leaving. That's what the Auditor General found. You didn't know.

[Ted Gallivan]

Again, I'll share a small symbolic statement: In our IT systems, we didn't have an IT indicator showing whether somebody was in the country or not.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Ms. O'Gorman said that now they will have consequences. She was referring to people who are abusing the system. Do you agree that people will now have consequences as a result of some of the things you're talking about?

[Ted Gallivan]

I think it's essential, actually.

Going back to a theme that a number of members have explored, the soft touch, the nudge, only works if people know there's a real consequence. In order for the polite request of “Please leave, because your visa has expired” to work, there has to be a real consequence, or else they're just hollow words. I think tough consequences are not just appropriate but also essential to making the other interventions effective.

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Thank you, Mr. Gallivan.

Thank you, Mr. Redekopp.

We have just seven seconds left.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Could I say something quick?

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Okay. You have seven seconds.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

The important thing in that answer is that there were no consequences before. That's the implication in your answer. I think it's important that people know that, because that's what has caused a lot of these problems.

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Thank you, Mr. Redekopp.

Thank you, Mr. Gallivan.

I want to alert everyone that the clerk just received the IRCC's detailed management action plan for addressing the audit on international student programs. That should be in your inboxes momentarily.

Next, we have five minutes for Ms. Sodhi.

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'd like to turn to you, Ms. O'Gorman. I was wondering if you can tell the committee how recent reforms to the international student program improved the CBSA's ability to verify that students entering Canada meet their study permit conditions.

[Erin O'Gorman]

What the deputy has outlined is collaboration in determining who's still here, whether people whose student visas expired have left and whether further action doesn't now need to be taken. That's the collaboration that will take place between the two organizations in looking to see who's still here.

The CBSA maintains the entry-exit system. We have that information, and it can be examined at a greater rate than IRCC.... The IRCC can go in and look at individuals, whereas we can run bigger inventories against that. That's a collaboration that's happening and will continue to happen.

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

What trends are you seeing in compliance rates among international students upon entry, compared to previous years?

[Erin O'Gorman]

I think it's a bit early to answer that question.

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Okay.

How are frontline officers trained to apply updated program rules while ensuring a fair and efficient experience for legitimate students?

[Erin O'Gorman]

As international students arrive at the port of entry, our officers are very adept at detecting any fraud. In some cases, before IRCC issues a student visa, the individual will be subject to a security screening. That's conducted in part by the CBSA, so I should have started with that.

Sometimes before a student visa is issued, the applicant is subject to security screening. When they are issued a student visa and they come to the port of entry, the officers examine that. As I said, officers are very adept at detecting fraud and can pose questions if they think there are any issues.

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Let me know if it is too early to answer this question as well: Have you seen any early indicators that the reforms are helping to deter bad actors from attempting to exploit our system?

[Erin O'Gorman]

The cancellation of the program was quite important for the CBSA, so in that sense, yes. The audit makes the point about high-risk countries that were subject to that program, so I will say that in that context, it did have a positive impact.

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

IRCC has committed to providing the CBSA annually with a list of individuals whose study permits have expired and who have not transitioned to another immigration status. When you receive that list from IRCC, how quickly do you anticipate your agency will be able to match it against entry and exit records to identify who has departed and who might still be in Canada without status?

Mr. Gallivan, if you need to answer that, you can too.

[Ted Gallivan]

I don't want to speak for Ms. O'Gorman, but I think there's been some refinement in our thinking. There's going to be a lot more active effort before that list is provided to the CBSA. In other words, we're going to seek to determine whether people have left the country in the first instance, and then we're going to try to influence them before that deadline occurs. Then we might have a couple of attempts afterwards.

In other words, we want to bring the numbers down and try to manage the population so that they do leave the country before we have to pass it over to the CBSA for active enforcement action.

[Erin O'Gorman]

We said it would be annually, but there's nothing holding us to annually, quarterly or semi-annually. We will get to a cadence that makes the most sense.

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

For individuals who are confirmed to be in Canada without valid status, how will your agency prioritize follow-up, and how does the international student population fit within the broader enforcement priorities that the CBSA might have?

[Erin O'Gorman]

That's what makes the IRCC's work that Mr. Gallivan has outlined so important.

The CBSA prioritizes serious inadmissibilities, war crimes, serious criminality and terrorism. We also prioritize failed asylum claimants, and then everybody else. People will move between those categories. Most students are genuine and will remove themselves on the basis of the work that's being discussed today. Some have come for the wrong reason, and they may find themselves in our serious inadmissibility category. Every year, as a matter of course, we do remove individuals who are out of compliance with their immigration status, and we'll continue to do that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Thank you, Ms. Sodhi.

Thank you, Ms. O'Gorman.

That completes our third round of questions. I feel like we're in a boxing match, but this is a friendly one.

We're in our fourth round. We'll begin with the very friendly and happy Mr. Menegakis.

[Costas Menegakis, Conservative, Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'm going to address my first questions to you, Ms. Hogan.

There seems to be a disconnect between the government's attitude that Conservatives want to talk about the past but Canadians want to talk about the future, and what is actually happening on the ground and what we are actually hearing from Canadians on a daily basis.

I represent a community in the greater Toronto area that is home to a large segment of Canadians of Iranian descent. There's a lot of concern in the community about the reported 700 IRGC operatives, if not more, who are living in our community and threatening Canadians, permanent residents and people with temporary visas on a daily basis.

I want to touch on the light touch in the file review process. I'm wondering if you would consider doing a deeper dive in auditing a process that has historically and very recently allowed people like IRGC operatives into our communities, because they're not just the past. They're present, and they will be an issue in the future unless this is addressed.