Citizenship and Immigration Committee on June 3rd, 2026

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you for that.

I'll use Quebec as an example, as my colleague did earlier. You know that we have major universities in the Montreal area and throughout the province of Quebec. We are attracting talent, and we need to keep it. Artificial intelligence and aerospace are industries that are mainly located in the Montreal region.

Looking at Quebec, are there any difficulties or differences that should be raised in connection with our immigration system?

[Laurent Carbonneau]

That's a very good question.

That's one I would have to go back to members on in order to see if they've heard anything specific. I have not necessarily heard anything to indicate that there are Quebec-specific difficulties regarding talent attraction.

I will say that, certainly—

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

There's one minute left.

[Laurent Carbonneau]

Okay.

Certainly, we heard this in the context of recent changes to the language laws. I think most people appreciate that French is the language of business in Quebec. That's not a problem, but the recent changes created, I think, a bit of a chill among people looking at their options from outside the province, who said, “This seems complicated.” You're never going to see a statistic anywhere of people who have looked at that situation and decided they didn't want to deal with it, but it is real and we hear about it. It affects investment decisions. It affects people's relocation decisions and all kinds of things.

Once again, I really want to underline my respect for the fact that French is the language of business in Quebec. That's totally the case, and I wouldn't want it otherwise. It is just a reality we deal with.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

We can attract the French, the Belgians, the Africans and other francophones.

[Laurent Carbonneau]

Absolutely.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Thank you, Madame Lapointe and Mr. Carbonneau.

We have just a few minutes left, so I'm going to give a minute and a half to Mr. Menegakis and a minute and a half to Mr. Fragiskatos.

Mr. Menegakis, go ahead, please.

[Costas Menegakis, Conservative, Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Mr. Parker, do you believe the temporary foreign worker program has been used by employers to avoid raising wages and investing in training Canadian tradespeople?

[Terry Parker]

Yes, I do. It's simple.

We have a lot of apprentices willing to go to work. I have lists and lists of people who are interested in going into the trades. Any day of the week, I can pull out hundreds who would like to get involved in the trades, but they can't because there are misuses happening out there in the system. There's not enough work for all these individuals. It's this competition happening that is undermining our system.

[Costas Menegakis, Conservative, Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON]

We see youth unemployment spiking. Are there young Canadians who want to enter the trades but are being crowded out because employers would rather access temporary foreign labour than invest in training them?

[Terry Parker]

Roughly, we currently have 16% to 17% youth unemployment in Alberta. That's unacceptable. We need to put Canadians first.

[Costas Menegakis, Conservative, Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON]

Do you believe one of the many reasons we see high youth unemployment is that employers stopped investing in Canadians the moment the government handed them a cheaper labour pipeline?

[Terry Parker]

I'm not saying this is the sole cause. However, when an employer is faced with getting labour for half the price, they sometimes take that option to find a way to lower their costs and increase their profit. It's as simple as that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Thank you, Mr. Parker and Mr. Menegakis.

Mr. Fragiskatos, go ahead for one and a half minutes, please.

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London Centre, ON]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Thank you to all witnesses for being here today.

I have one minute, so I'm going to direct my questions to Mr. Carbonneau—or Mr. Perry, if he wishes.

Is the relative challenge we have—the youth unemployment issue that was just mentioned—caused by the temporary foreign worker program?

[Laurent Carbonneau]

I'm not a macroeconomist, so I don't think I know enough to say anything on the broader question there.

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London Centre, ON]

Okay. I'll stay with that issue.

If I take your main point to be that the program is important for the Canadian economy, reforms are needed. You mentioned the example of Amazon. I would agree with that. We can think of other companies that are engaged in practices that would be inappropriate from the perspective of most Canadians.

We sometimes hear calls from friends in the opposition to cancel the program outright. What do you think of that?

[Laurent Carbonneau]

As I mentioned, I can only really speak for the global talent stream. I think that program is really valuable. We've talked around it a bit.

There are certainly issues with the temporary foreign worker program. I don't know enough about it to say at a super high level what should be done, but I can tell you with great certainty that it would be an absolute tragedy to lose the global talent stream if it were to be lost.

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London Centre, ON]

I think they want to get rid of that as well.

Thank you very much for putting on the record a very reasonable point of view.

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Thank you, Mr. Fragiskatos.

Thank you, Mr. Carbonneau.

Before I thank you formally, I know there's some follow-up from the question Mr. Davies asked, if I could just put that on the record.

Also, you mentioned that you represent 175 companies. If you happen to have data on the skill and labour needs they have, that might be helpful to this committee, as we're looking at how to identify that.

This is the last thing. You were talking about how it's hard to keep industrialists here in Canada. It would be good if you could define that a bit. It will help us in identifying the solutions.

With that, I want to thank all of the witnesses for today.

We are now going to suspend for about five to 10 minutes so the current witnesses can leave and we can get back with the second panel of witnesses.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Welcome to the second panel of today's meeting.

It's nice to see that everybody is here with us in person. It's always a pleasure to welcome everyone, but it's nice to have people in the room.

As I did before, I would like to make a few comments for the benefit of our new witnesses. Kindly wait until I recognize you by name before speaking. I will let you know when you have one minute left. If you would like to listen in a different language, please make sure you're selecting it before you get started. Finally, I'll remind you that all comments should be addressed through the chair.

Now I would like to formally welcome our witnesses on the second panel.

As an individual, we have Mr. Ethan Miranda. Welcome.

From the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees, we have Michael Casasola, senior resettlement and complementary pathways officer, and Sandra Elgersma, resettlement and complementary pathways officer, durable solutions, labour mobility. That's a great title. Welcome to you both.

From the World University Service of Canada, we have Mr. Steve Mason, chief executive officer.

It's such a pleasure to warmly welcome all of you.

Each organization will have up to five minutes. We're going to begin with Mr. Miranda.

Your five minutes begin now.

[Ethan Miranda, As an Individual]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you to the committee for inviting me to take part in this meeting.

My name is Ethan Miranda. I'm a 25-year-old software engineer from Scarborough, in the east end of Toronto. I graduated from the University of Western Ontario in June 2024.

After graduating, I spent almost two years unemployed. In that time, I applied to over 500 positions and spent countless hours going through the interview process at various companies, rarely even receiving the courtesy of a rejection letter. All I was able to get was a part-time volunteer position as a software engineer at a Vancouver-based charity and a 20-hour-a-week position at a small tech start-up. I only successfully found full-time employment when I shifted my focus away from software engineering.

My story is not unique. Since graduating, I have personally spoken to dozens of other recent graduates in software engineering and computer science who are struggling to find employment, many of them for extended periods of time, due to a lack of entry level positions in tech.

My experience led me to ask a simple question: If highly educated Canadian graduates cannot find a pathway into the tech industry, how will Canada develop the experienced workforce it needs in the future? If Canadian graduates are unable to gain that experience at home, many may look elsewhere for opportunities, resulting in a potential loss of talent that Canada has already invested heavily in educating.

As such, I am here today to express my concern that efforts to attract highly skilled tech talent from abroad are not being matched by equivalent efforts to develop Canadian graduates. While it is true that there is a lot of demand for senior tech workers in Canada, particularly in AI, machine learning, data science, cybersecurity and cloud computing, there is no shortage of talented young Canadian software engineers who are eager and willing to fill this demand. The issue is not a lack of talent, but a lack of experience and the opportunity to gain it.

Youth unemployment has risen steadily in the past few years, from 9% in June 2022 to 14.3% in April 2026. Many of these unemployed young people are graduates in engineering, computer science and other tech disciplines. According to the Indeed Hiring Lab, postings for junior and standard tech roles in Canada have dropped 25% compared to pre-pandemic levels, while postings for senior and manager roles are above pre-pandemic levels.

While this problem is not specific to AI and can be found even in web development and application development, roles tied directly to AI, such as machine learning engineers, data engineers and data centre technicians, continue to show elevated demand. These are areas in which Canadian universities already provide education, but unfortunately they are still not accessible to new graduates, as they often require years of experience. In fact, even many roles labelled as entry-level require prior experience, effectively removing the first step on the career ladder for new graduates.

As a result of the mismatch between entry-level supply and experienced labour demand, efforts to address senior talent shortages entirely through immigration may unintentionally increase competition in the early career job market for Canadian graduates if not carefully designed. If we flood the market with senior engineers from abroad, then employers have no incentive to hire and train Canadian new grads because they have easy and cheap access to foreign senior engineers who can hit the ground running, as opposed to investing the time and money into training a junior engineer from Canada who may take a few years to ramp up.

Canada's skilled immigration policy should complement domestic talent pipelines, not replace them. Every senior engineer, AI specialist, cybersecurity expert and technology leader began as a junior employee who was given an opportunity.

If Canada wants a strong technology sector in 10 years, we must ensure that today's graduates have a chance to build the experience right now that future demands will require. I strongly believe Canada can be a global leader in technology, but this cannot come at the expense of an entire generation of Canadian graduates. I respectfully ask that you advocate for policies that incentivize companies to hire and train junior Canadian engineers, invest in graduate upskilling programs in fields like AI and cybersecurity and ensure that efforts to attract global talent are matched by equally strong investments in developing Canada's domestic talent pipeline.

Thank you for your time. I'm happy to answer any questions you may have.

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Thank you very much.

Next we have five minutes for Mr. Casasola.

Your five minutes begin now.

[Michael Casasola, Senior Resettlement and Complementary Pathways Officer, United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

UNHCR is pleased to appear as part of the committee's study on attracting global talent.

Refugees represent an untapped talent pool that Canadian employers have only recently been able to reach, thanks to the economic mobility pathways pilot, or EMPP, introduced in 2018, which has provided an additional option for refugees with the commensurate skills to access Canada. UNHCR welcomed the EMPP and looks forward to Canada delivering on its pledge at the Global Refugee Forum to make the EMPP a permanent program.

Back in 2018, Canada was a pioneer, testing the extent to which refugees could access permanent economic immigration programs without changing human capital requirements. This testing found that refugees have the skills and experience, but may face barriers related to their displacement, such as the inability to provide a valid passport.

The EMPP was designed so that refugees could overcome these barriers and access economic immigration on a level playing field. Thanks to IRCC, NGO partners and employers, more than 1,300 refugees have immigrated to Canada through the EMPP to date. The key learning has been constant: When given a chance, refugees can compete with other economic immigrants to provide much-needed talent that allows businesses to maintain operations or expand.

From the outset, Canada has been clear that refugee labour mobility does not replace resettlement or asylum, but instead offers an additional opportunity for refugees who meet the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act's economic objectives. UNHCR affirms this approach, particularly in the global context of record levels of forced displacement and shrinking solution opportunities for refugees. Creative partnerships with civil society and the private sector are needed, as set out in the Global Compact for Refugees.

The private sector is critical to the EMPP, as most applications have been anchored with a job offer. We'd like to acknowledge employers such as Glen Haven Manor, St. Joseph's Care Group, Tri-County Mennonite Homes, Newfoundland and Labrador Health Services, Chancellor Park, Ice River Springs and IKO Industries, among many others. These employers have made refugee recruitment an integral part of their international talent strategies, sometimes travelling to refugee camps for recruitment missions. As a result, refugees are on the job in communities such as Pictou County, Nova Scotia, and Thunder Bay, as well as in Canada's major cities.

Just like other economic programs, the EMPP needs to work smoothly for employers. We've heard their concerns about processing times and predictability. The EMPP has been affected by limited space in the annual levels plan and the inventory of applications, leading to long processing times. While this situation is similar for other economic immigrant streams, refugees have difficulty meeting the requirements for temporary work permits that would allow them to start work while their permanent resident application is processed. We look forward to learning how IRCC will address this issue, informed by the evaluation of the pilot that is under way.

Our own research shows that the EMPP has delivered results. Our surveys found that EMPP alumni have a high rate of staying with their employer and/or sector, and many experience career progression. UNHCR has also organized focus groups with EMPP alumni. What stands out is their drive and eagerness to invest in themselves through ongoing training and upskilling. Alumni expressed gratitude for the opportunity and would recommend immigrating through EMPP to other refugees.

Our research also uncovered that those arriving through the EMPP have struggled with credential recognition, just like other economic immigrants. With partners, UNHCR is interested in how these issues can be addressed at a system, rather than individual, level.

The Nova Scotia Pharmacy Regulator provides a great example. Their Jordan pharmacy licensure pathway fast-tracked the pathway to practise for immigrants trained in Jordan, following a thorough evaluation of the pharmacy education programs, meeting with the Government of Jordan, and the assessment and recruitment of candidates. The initial cohort recruited through this initiative and now working as pharmacists in Nova Scotia includes 11 refugees and six Jordanian nationals.

With the EMPP as a permanent program, ideally with faster processing times and significant spaces, refugee inclusion could be mainstreamed. A reliable immigration pathway could unlock potential. It would allow employers looking for cohorts of skilled refugees to move forward with recruiting and would allow regulators looking for systemic partnerships to proceed, confident that the immigration route will facilitate them. For our part, UNHCR is confident that the next nurse, roofer and French immersion teacher in refugee circumstances is just waiting for the opportunity to put their skills to use and in turn help meet Canada's unmet employment needs.

Thank you.