Why?
Evidence of meeting #20 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 39th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was program.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #20 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 39th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was program.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Executive Coordinator of Post-secondary Education, Education Branch, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
It's something that we would be dealing with as we create our new management framework.
Bloc
Marc Lemay Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
May I remind you that the reason this committee went to the trouble of studying the issue of post-secondary education is that action was urgently needed. This has been called for.
Over the past few weeks, we have been told more than once how difficult it is to reach the post-secondary level. I understand those difficulties, but now, somebody is knocking on the door, and the knocking is very loud. Can the committee rest assured that steps are going to be taken, and above all, that this will be reflected in the upcoming budget, which, let us hope, is going to be tabled in February or March 2007? In light of the recommendations, are funding requests going to be made?
Acting Senior Assistant Deputy Minister, Socio-Economic Policy and Regional Operations, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
We cannot guarantee you that any particular item will appear in the budget. That is beyond our control. However, one thing is for sure: we are currently working on policy renewal. We also have to see to it that the way in which the program is managed is improved, in response to the Auditor General's findings. We also hope that the work will enable us to identify the needs. However, officials do not have the power to make sure that the budget addresses those needs.
Bloc
Marc Lemay Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
Of course, I understand all of that, having been involved in sports for years. I know how it works.
You establish a policy.
Acting Senior Assistant Deputy Minister, Socio-Economic Policy and Regional Operations, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Yes.
Bloc
Marc Lemay Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
And you assess the costs of its implementation. That is what I want to hear. October and November are budget preparation time. That is where we are at now. The Minister may be asked to do his job after, but for your part, are you going to translate that into figures?
Bloc
Marc Lemay Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
But can she answer my question, Mr. Chairman? Give her 30 seconds.
Acting Senior Assistant Deputy Minister, Socio-Economic Policy and Regional Operations, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
In fact, to determine how much money we need, we have to know what the demand is. For the time being, the information we have is inaccurate. So we cannot say whether we need double $300 million or how much is available to us. We will have to get that information before we can forecast the needs.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Colin Mayes
I hope this committee can accommodate some input into that as we deliver our report on post-secondary education.
Madam Crowder.
Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you all for coming.
I have a brief comment before I ask a question.
You talked about the K to 12 system, and I think we all would acknowledge that there are some serious problems with the K to 12 system. However, there are some serious problems in post-secondary education. Unless there's a very clear focus and some action on the numerous reports...as you probably are well aware, the researcher has given us numerous reports over a number of years that have talked about recommendations for post-secondary education and yet there isn't substantial movement. There are increasing numbers of students who simply do not have access to a post-secondary education, whether it's vocational, trades, technical, or university. So I think there needs to be some serious movement on that.
In your presentation you said there's $1.5 billion in planned education expenditure. Is it possible to provide the committee with an estimate of how much of that money actually contributes directly to bottoms in seats, to students in seats, the direct delivery? I don't imagine you can answer that today.
In your presentation you also talked about the fact that you've completed your draft policy framework--I assume that's on the K to 12 system--and you're working on your management framework. Is it possible for the committee to get a copy of the draft policy framework?
You also indicated that over time investment in first nations and Inuit post-secondary education has increased significantly. My understanding is that over 10 years the increase has been at 2%, which is significantly under the growth in the population. That's just a comment.
You also indicated that you have committed to undertaking a review of post-secondary education and that the review has involved the participation...and so on. Is there any written documentation on that or a preliminary report that the committee could have access to?
Those are some follow-up items on your presentation.
One of the things the committee has heard quite clearly, and we had the benefit of going to the Nunavut school in Ottawa, is that there is a real challenge for first nations educational institutions to have access to funding. One of the mechanisms that institutions have is the ISSP, which is project-based. That's my understanding of it.
There are two pieces to that. One is that the Inuit, as far as we've been able to determine, have not accessed ISSP funding despite the fact that they're in the criteria. That's one question. The second question is that under Bill C-48 the government made a determination to allocate some money towards capital expenditures, yet first nations institutions, it is my understanding, were not allocated any capital expenditures. I would like you to confirm that it is true that they didn't get any capital expenditures. And if not, why not?
Executive Coordinator of Post-secondary Education, Education Branch, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Regarding the ISSP program that you're familiar with, Inuit organizations have in fact received ISSP funding.
NDP
Executive Coordinator of Post-secondary Education, Education Branch, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Inuit organizations that have received ISSP funding?
Executive Coordinator of Post-secondary Education, Education Branch, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Yes.
The situation in Nunavut and the Northwest Territories is quite complex in terms of the way the funding has been made available. Because the governments of Northwest Territories and Nunavut both provide post-secondary student funding, our ISSP funding across the country operates as a 12% proportion of the overall Indian Affairs post-secondary budget. The challenge has been in relation to the territories, because there is no Indian Affairs student funding provided in those two territories. That means the ISSP funding doesn't have a base. But in fact within the terms and conditions of the program, Inuit organizations are as eligible as first nations organizations or institutions.
NDP
Executive Coordinator of Post-secondary Education, Education Branch, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
In every other region of the country, the institutions would go to the Indian Affairs regional offices and apply.
NDP
Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC
But you're saying that there isn't a mechanism in Nunavut for them to do that.
Executive Coordinator of Post-secondary Education, Education Branch, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
In fact there has been post-secondary funding disbursed through the regional office in Nunavut.