Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Feb. 26th, 2009

[Christine Cram]

I believe the federal government did provide $3.5 million. I do not recall in what year, but I believe it was part of the Socio-economic Forum. The province of Quebec provided a similar amount. However, I cannot tell you specifically what that money was used for.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

It was invested in infrastructure. In terms of subsequent funding, such as the kind you are providing to the University of Saskatchewan, are there amounts set aside to keep the First Nations University Pavilion operating?

[Christine Cram]

Not to my knowledge. It's possible, but I do not have that information.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

In answer to a question from our current chair, Mr. Yeates said that in every province, the costs of operating primary schools were different. Does the same apply at the post-secondary level?

[Neil Yeates]

Yes, I think it is. Provinces make different decisions on the level of funding they want to provide. You're probably very well aware that one of the key issues in post-secondary education over the years has been the level of tuition. Provinces have made quite different decisions about the level of tuition that they wanted to see set. As you would know, Quebec in particular has maintained tuition at a fairly low level in comparison to other provinces. But that is all within the jurisdiction of those provinces and the universities themselves.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Todd Russell]

Mr. Lévesque, you have 30 seconds.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

I am going to take advantage of that to ask a question that interests me.

In Nunavut, there is a cost-sharing arrangement for post-secondary education. Does the same rule apply to Nunavik? If so, how does that work?

[Christopher Duchesnes]

Thank you very much, Mr. Lévesque.

Under section 17 of the James Bay and Northern Quebec Agreement, the federal and provincial governments provide funding each year for post-secondary education; 75 per cent of the total amount is paid by the province and 25 per cent is paid by the federal government. Last year, the amount was approximately $2.4 million, or $600,000 in federal funds. That is something that is negotiated and renewed every three years.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

Thank you very much.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Todd Russell]

Thank you, Mr. Lévesque.

Mr. Payne.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. You've changed your looks here from—

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Todd Russell]

He's a helluva lot better looking. Even his wife says so.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

Anyway, I understand as a new member, through some of the questioning that the recently removed chair, Mr. Russell, was talking about, in regard to some of the funding for schools and the $200 million, which you referred to in your discussion, that these poor, rundown schools go back many, many years. Do you have a record of how far back these schools go; or is it just recently, in the last few years, that the need has arisen for these schools to be replaced or refurbished?

[Neil Yeates]

On-reserve, there are 12 schools. This has been a challenge for many, many years, but it's not just a challenge being faced by INAC. A lot of infrastructure was built in the late 1960s and early to mid-1970s, and it's all coming due to be replaced at the same time. Municipalities, school boards, and health regions are all facing similar kinds of challenges, and we certainly are as well. So we have some catching up to do.

But we're very pleased with the additional funding that we have through budget 2009 for these 10 new schools. There will be three major renovation projects, as well as additional funding for water and waste water treatment plants. So that's going to make a big difference for us. But yes, the need has been high.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

I am pleased to see that the government is certainly putting funding into that. I understand that Minister Strahl has recently announced—today, as a matter of fact—a new school for grades K to 8 at Burnt Church, New Brunswick, as part of the government's economic plan. I'm assuming that must be part of that $200 million.

[Neil Yeates]

Yes, it is.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

You have two and a half minutes still. Are you finished, Mr. Payne? Do you want more time?

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

No.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Okay, we'll go to Madam Crowder, and then Mr. Bélanger.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

When I looked again at the Auditor General's report, because she raises many good points, she talked about the fact, again, that limited progress has been made. Based on the information she had in 2004, the gap has increased slightly from about 27 to 28 years, based on when they could anticipate aboriginal first nations would actually get the same--

[Neil Yeates]

Do you mean the attainment gap?

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

Yes.

One of the things they talked about in paragraph 5.3 is that as a result, the department.... There are lots of things about lack of information. We've already covered the fact that you're developing a system but that the department does not know whether program funds are sufficient to support the eligible students. So it's a little troubling that many people believe, and there was certainly a hint from the Auditor General, that there are not enough funds available to meet the need.

One factor that we know prevents students from attending, in many aboriginal communities, is poverty. We know that poverty rates on reserve are significantly higher than they are in the rest of Canada. When we look at the Human Development Index, first nations on reserves rank, in many cases, with people in the third world.

So when I hear that some of the options being considered are looking at going to Canada student loans or not having a 100% grant basis.... We already know that there are significant barriers to many first nations students attending. I can't remember the percentage, but there is a percentage of women who are attending, and you outlined the fact that they often have additional responsibilities caring for children and, as we also know anecdotally, caring for elders in their communities.

So when you look at these potential options, what other options are you considering that would address the poverty barriers to people attending post-secondary?

[Neil Yeates]

Well, the array of options we're looking at goes the full gamut. One is looking at increasing special support for students who have barriers, if you like, beyond what you might consider the average student would have.

We are concerned, as I think perhaps you're expressing as well, that some of the neediest students are not getting the level of support they need. I think we would say, though, that not all first nations communities are in the same situation. Some are relatively well off, and not all aboriginal families in those communities are in the same situation.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

I'm sorry to interrupt, but I only have five minutes.

I'm well aware of that, but I think it's well documented that poverty rates overall are higher among first nations on reserves. It's not that there aren't some communities that do better, and it's not that there aren't some families that do better, but the reality is, if you look around.... In my own community I have a number of reserves, and generally the poverty rates are pretty grim. And I'm in an urban-rural area; I'm not in a remote community, and in remote communities it's even worse.