Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Oct. 23rd, 2017

[TJ Harvey, Liberal, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

It's very similar to my riding, actually, only you're spread out over a lot vaster territory. Do you think there are some likenesses to large rural ridings in the way that provincial governments deliver health care in those ridings? Do you think there's relevance there to what you're trying to do?

[Robert R. McLeod]

Only if your rural ridings have no roads and you can only get there by air, or maybe by boat in the summertime; I think there would be some relevance.

Also, probably similar to your riding, we have difficulty attracting health professionals, not only doctors and nurses. We've had to make some very unique arrangements to provide health services to some of those remote communities.

[TJ Harvey, Liberal, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

In terms of land claim issues, we've heard a vast number of opinions from across the country, throughout the study. I think they are all relevant to the circumstance that they are in. We even heard some differences of opinion this morning from witnesses in terms of overlap of claim. What are your thoughts on overlap of claim? What's the best way to address overlap of claim between indigenous nations?

[Robert R. McLeod]

Well, I think the best way is to get everybody into a room and keep them there until they come out with a solution. I think that seems to have worked out the best in the past. I think that with aboriginal rights, if both sides possess rights, then it's very hard to resolve it with some negotiating methods such as arbitration or mediation, and so on. That may lend itself to a decision, but I think for the most part, to get both parties and work with them or facilitate discussions to come to a resolution probably still works the best.

[TJ Harvey, Liberal, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

The reason I asked the question is that in the previous panel, we had two communities that have a conflicting boundary issue. It's an issue that affects them. Mostly they seem to be very amicable about it. They weren't hostile about it, but it's centred around the economic development opportunities of that conflicted area. So in terms of questions around the development of those opportunities, it lends itself to uncertainty, too. That's the reason I asked the question.

[Robert R. McLeod]

Well, I think in that sense we've been talking about generalized interests where everybody can share. When it comes to wildlife issues, I think it gets a little more complicated.

[TJ Harvey, Liberal, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Okay. Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, MaryAnn Mihychuk]

Everyone has now had an opportunity, so typically the questioning would go back to the Conservative side. Is there interest in doing another round?

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

How much time do we have?

[The Chair, Liberal, MaryAnn Mihychuk]

We have about 10 minutes.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Then absolutely.

[The Chair, Liberal, MaryAnn Mihychuk]

So one of the McLeods wants to ask—oh, two McLeods. It is a family thing.

MP Cathy McLeod.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Again, I know that things are always unique in terms of how the natural resource revenue-sharing goes. Can you just refresh me in terms of your devolution agreement? How much is direct? Does the federal government still take their piece of the pie? How is your devolution agreement set up around the sharing of resource revenue?

[Robert R. McLeod]

We collect 100% of the resource revenues, and we remit the federal portion to the federal government. The remainder is split. We put 25% into a heritage fund, and we give 25% to the aboriginal governments that have signed on to devolution. The aboriginal governments that have signed on to devolution have worked out a formula that they have all agreed to, and the remainder stays with our government.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Unlike the provinces, I think the federal government still takes a pretty significant cut.

[Robert R. McLeod]

Yes. I think it's about 75% or something like that...or 50%, sorry.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

That's still pretty significant.

You have a structure for the devolution. How does that intersect with...? Let's say there's been agreement to proceed with a mine on someone's territory. How does that all intersect together?

[Robert R. McLeod]

Generally, for a mine, because of the fact that they have invested significant funds, it's usually at least three years before they start paying resource royalties, because they recover all of their costs for building a mine. Then, if they do invest in any infrastructure, well, that reduces the resource revenues as well.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

If a community has not been part of a devolution agreement, but a mine is going to be built on their territory, do they have a separate and side agreement?

[Robert R. McLeod]

Well, through the regulatory process, they typically would have an IBA, an impact benefit agreement, and through that, they negotiate with the developer or the proponent. We don't have access when it's negotiated at that level.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

The issue of transboundary came up earlier, and we heard about the transboundary between the Northwest Territories and Yukon. You also talked about transboundary issues with Manitoba and Saskatchewan. Those must be particularly challenging issues to resolve. Is there a different way that those are approached? Could you talk a little bit about the transboundary issues and resolution?

[Robert R. McLeod]

In the two cases there, we recognized historical aboriginal use and occupancy, and we've suggested that it should be reciprocal. If land is taken away in the Northwest Territories for aboriginal governments in the provinces, they should do the same for aboriginal governments in the territories that have traditional use and occupancy in other provinces. We think it's only fair that it should be reciprocal.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

And that's not the case, then?

[Robert R. McLeod]

No, it hasn't been the case.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Thank you.