Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Feb. 2nd, 2021

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Thanks so much, Ms. Poitras.

We have limestone, which is an ingredient of blast furnaces with the iron ore, and the sheltered harbour. However, our geology also gave us flint, which was important for the Chonnonton first nation. They traded in flints.

With that, we move on to Madam Normandin, for six minutes, please.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Chief Poitras, thank you for your testimony, which I listened to with great interest. It was well documented, very consistent and very clear.

Before asking my questions, I would like to make a small preamble to explain the position of the Bloc Québécois and its support for first nations' claims.

When the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples was being discussed in Geneva, the Bloc Québécois was present. In 2004, it was part of the working group for the development of the declaration. The Bloc Québécois was also in Geneva in 2006 to finalize the process. In 2007, when the agreement was completed, Canada did not ratify it. The Bloc Québécois then lobbied, insisted in the House and asked questions of the Harper government until 2010, when the declaration was finally signed by Canada.

It's one of the things we've been supporting for a long time. We also agree with the recommendations and calls for action contained in the report of the Truth and Reconciliation Commission of Canada. We strongly support the principle of Bill C-8, which seeks to recognize the rights of first nations in the oath of citizenship.

I'd like you to tell me about the exact wording of the text; you've already touched on it a bit. It may be a very small detail, but what is being recognized is the Constitution in which the indigenous and treaty rights of indigenous people are mentioned. Would you agree that indigenous and treaty rights should be recognized more specifically, rather than specifically referring to the Constitution?

[Regional Chief Marlene Poitras]

As I said previously, the Constitution is the highest law of Canada. Treaty rights and aboriginal rights are recognized in there. To me that already exists. It is just a matter of taking those words and incorporating them into the citizenship oath.

To me, as long as the treaty and inherent rights are acknowledged, I think that goes a long way for Canada. That's a good start in acknowledging that we have treaty and inherent rights in this country. However the wording is in the end, I'm fine as long as our treaty rights are included.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

I'm going to continue in the same vein, just to make sure that we understand each other.

First nations rights were not created by the Constitution. They existed long before. Indeed, first nations are nations, and as such, they have rights. You talk about inherent rights, and they existed before the Constitution. Didn't they?

[Regional Chief Marlene Poitras]

From my understanding and what I was told by my family, my great-great-grandfather signed adhesion to Treaty 8 on July 13, 1899. He did that on behalf of our nation. Only nations could enter into treaty.

We have inherent rights to the land. That's what we're born with. Treaties preceded that and even preceded the Canadian Constitution.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

As a minority, Quebeckers recognize themselves in this. Whenever the rights of aboriginal peoples are defended as a nation, we feel that we are also defending our rights as a Quebec nation.

Isn't the main thing to recognize the rights of first nations and to confirm the existence of these rights for centuries, rather than to specifically recognize the Constitution?

[Regional Chief Marlene Poitras]

The recognition of the rights is something for which my ancestors have been fighting for hundreds of years, east and west. I believe that it's high time that those rights be not only recognized but also implemented and that the treaties be implemented. To me, that is very important to the reconciliation process.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Can it be said that there is still a long way to go in terms of the Constitution? It does not yet cover all the rights of first nations that need to be recognized.

[Regional Chief Marlene Poitras]

Section 35 of the Constitution does incorporate the treaty and aboriginal rights, and I believe it also includes the Métis and the Inuit. I think it's just a matter of treaty implementation. One of the things that we've always strived for is to have a treaty implementation policy, because as you are aware the Indian Act was put into place even before Treaty 8 was signed and we were put under that.

For Canada to set it right, it has to put in some policy or some recognition that treaties exist in this country and are in Canada's Constitution, which is the highest law of the land. Our belief is that treaties are also the highest law of the land.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Thanks, Ms. Poitras.

We go to Ms. Kwan now for six minutes.

Please, go ahead.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you so much, Chief Poitras, for your comments. I think they are very informative for this committee.

As we are talking about the Constitution, section 35 reads:

(1) The existing aboriginal and treaty rights of the aboriginal peoples of Canada are hereby recognized and affirmed.

(2) In this Act, “aboriginal peoples of Canada” includes the Indian, Inuit and Métis peoples of Canada.

That's the language in section 35.

In your comments you raised the issue of inherent rights, with which I absolutely agree. There needs to be full recognition of the inherent rights of the indigenous peoples.

In terms of the wording of the text for the changes for the swearing-in, what would you think if these words were added: “inherent rights of indigenous peoples as recognized by the UN Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples”? After the language that says, “I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada”, insert the words “inherent rights of indigenous peoples as recognized by the UN Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples”, and then carry on to say, “including the Constitution”, etc.

What are your thoughts on that?

[Regional Chief Marlene Poitras]

UNDRIP is currently being discussed. I believe that was introduced in December and that is something that especially the treaty first nations have some issues with, because they believe that a treaty is an agreement and that exists and nothing has really moved forward on the recognition of our treaties even though we've been advocating for that for a number of years.

If you wanted to include that wording, I would ensure that the first nations leadership, especially those with treaties, be consulted, because there are some issues. I believe that in order to incorporate language into the citizenship oath, you have to have some agreement from people that they are satisfied that it is something worth including.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

There's concern with using the word UNDRIP. You would rather it simply say “inherent rights of”, maybe using the same language of first nations, Inuit, and Métis people.

Would you prefer that then, to simply recognize the inherent rights without reference to UNDRIP?

[Regional Chief Marlene Poitras]

The issue of UNDRIP is still being discussed. Legislation has been introduced and it hasn't received royal assent yet. There are still consultations. There's still the process that needs to continue where there will be appearances before committee. I would rather allow that to unfold before anything is mentioned to include other types of agreements that are not agreed to by everybody collectively, moving forward.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Maybe you can advise the committee specifically the words you would like to see changed in the citizenship oath as proposed, so that it reflects the inherent rights you mentioned earlier?

[Regional Chief Marlene Poitras]

The language that the AFM executive recommended...I will just read the addition. It's “including the inherent rights, titles, treaties and agreement with First Nations, and the rights and agreements with Métis and Inuit peoples”. That was the recommendation from the AFN executive.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

I have it. Thank you very much.

I would like to turn to the issue around education.

Beyond the citizenship guide, do you think there are other actions the government should take in education for newcomers?

[Regional Chief Marlene Poitras]

As I said, the true history needs to be told. We also have our cultures and ceremonies. I believe to have a well-rounded education is really important, so that newcomers can understand who we are and also take pride that they're coming into a country where indigenous peoples are part of the Canadian fabric.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bob Bratina]

Thanks so much.

Now we go to the five-minute round with Mr. Viersen. Mr. Battiste is next up.

Mr. Viersen, go ahead for five.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

I want to thank our witness for appearing here today,

I really appreciate your coming out. It's always good to have a fellow Albertan here.

There's been a lot of discussion around how the Constitution comes into this. Is there unanimity within your organization as to the inclusion of that word?

[Regional Chief Marlene Poitras]

I'll have to go back to the aspect that I recently read out. That is what we agreed to as the executive. For me to give you a well-rounded answer on that, I would have to consult with the executive.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

Sure.

I'm interested in pursuing the idea around ceremony a little. We have a ceremony when you take the oath. What's your idea of how we would incorporate...? Often we have government officials at that ceremony or RCMP in the red serge. What's your idea on how we would incorporate an indigenous perspective into that?

[Regional Chief Marlene Poitras]

We have so many ceremonial elders and of course it would have to be from the traditional area where the ceremony is being conducted. You would ask an elder from that region to be involved and to do an official welcome. We have various ceremonies for things, whether it's to welcome people or even with agreements as we had in the treaty. There are different aspects of that, and as I said before, I think to have our indigenous ceremonies included will go a long way.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

The TRC recommendation had specific wording for the citizenship ceremony oath. The current bill that's before us does not reflect that wording directly. Your recommendation is different again.

Was there an issue with the TRC discussions when they were drafting that wording? I know we had the people from the TRC here, and they said that it was more of a suggestion than definitive. Were you at all involved in that discussion with the TRC and how they came to their wording?

[Regional Chief Marlene Poitras]

No, I wasn't involved at the time.