Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on June 14th, 2022

[Calvin Aivgak Pedersen]

They are very important. The Canadian Rangers and search and rescue are our lifeline, really. They're the people there on the ground ready at a moment's notice when anything happens. Search and rescue will no doubt be ready a little faster than the Canadian Rangers just because of logistics, I guess, and paperwork and permissions, that kind of thing, but without the Canadian Rangers and search and rescue, I don't know where we would be. The stats would be a lot higher for loss of life and things like that.

Yes, they're very important for the north, in each community.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

[Member spoke in Inuktitut as follows:]

ᖁᔭᓐᓇᒦᒃ, ᐋ, ᐱᖃᑖᓗᕐ ᐊᐱᕆᔪᒪᕙᒋᑦ, ᐋ, ᐅᓂᒃᑳᐅᑎᔪᓐᓇᕐᒪ-ᖔᖅᐱᑦ, ᐋ, ᑕᒪᒃᑯᐊ ᐱᓕᕆᐊᖏᑦ ᑲᓇᐃᑎᐊᓐ ᕋᐃᓐᔫᕐᔅ ᖃᓄᖅ ᑲᔪᖏᖅᓴᐃᑲᓐᓂᕈᓐᓇᕐᒪᖓᑦᑕ ᓈᒻᒪᒃᓴᖃᑎᒌᓕᕐᓂᕐᒥᒃ, ᐋ, ᑖᒃᑯᐊ ᑲᓇᑕᓗ ᓄᓇᖃᖅᑳᖅᓯᒪᔪᐃᑦ ᓈᒻᒪᒃᓴᖃᑎᒌᓕᕆᐊᖃᖅᑎᒡᓗᒋᑦ.

[Inuktitut text interpreted as follows:]

Thank you.

I have a second question for you, Calvin. Please describe to me the role of the Canadian Rangers in advancing reconciliation in Canada, reconciliation with the aboriginal peoples in Canada.

[English]

[Calvin Aivgak Pedersen]

As Canadian Rangers, we're on the ground. We live here. We are from here. We know the land. We know the people. We know the history, and that's priceless in any situation. If you ask me to search here, I can be of great help, but I'm not from here. I don't know the land. I don't know anything here really. I'm lost here.

Having local knowledge and expertise makes a huge difference. It will make a difference in saving people's lives in a timely manner. Yes, I believe they are extremely important to the north.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

[Member spoke in Inuktitut as follows:]

ᖁᔭᓐᓇᒦᒃ, ᐋ, ᐱᕕᖃᕈᒪ ᓱᓕ, ᐊᐱᕆᔪᒪᕗᖓ ᑕᐃᒃᑯᐊ ᐅᓂᒃᑳᖅᑎᒡᓗᑎᑦ ᐅᖃᖅᑲᐅᒐᕕᑦ ᐱᖁᔨᕗᖔᕈᑎᓂᒃ ᐅᖃᖅᑲᐅᒐᕕᑦ, ᑖᒃᑯᐊ, ᐋ, ᐱᖁᔨᕗᖔᕈᑎᓕᐊᕆᓚᐅᖅᑕᑎᑦ ᐊᑐᖅᑕᐅᓂᓐᖏᑉᐸᑕ ᖃᓄᐃᓐᓇᔭᖅᐸᑦ, ᖃᓄᖅ ᑲᔪᓯᓇᔭᖅᐸᑦ, ᐋ, ᑖᓐᓇ ᑐᑭᓯᒃᑲᓐᓂᕈᒪᑐᐃᓐᓇᖅᑐᖓ ᐱᖁᔨᕗᖔᕈᑎᑎᑦ ᑲᔪᓯᑎᑕᐅᓐᖏᓐᓂᖅᐸᑕ ᖃᓄᐃᑦᑐᖃᕐᓇᕋᔭᖅᐸᒃᑭᐊᖅ.

[Inuktitut text interpreted as follows:]

Thank you again. I have more time for another question.

When you gave your report, you mentioned certain recommendations to improve services. The recommendations you are proposing were to be carried through and implemented. If you have trouble getting those implemented and heard, how does it affect the current work you do?

[English]

[Calvin Aivgak Pedersen]

If we don't get the help, it will mean loss of life. We're doing our best right now. We do save lives. We have been doing so for a number of years, but not to have any help would be kind of disastrous in my eyes. To lose one life is too much. If all it takes is a few dollars, a little bit of time and some people getting together, then let's do it. If it takes just that to save one life, let's do it. If that's all it takes, then yes.

If we don't get it, then we will continue to do this like we have for years, but we will struggle. We don't have the proper safety gear. We don't have the proper equipment. All we use basically is our own gear. We don't even have diving teams, wetsuits or the dry suits that go for this time of year. Safety equipment would be awesome to have.

Basically we go out with a snowmobile or sled, and that's about it. The sled box becomes the stretcher. We don't have the proper gear to properly save lives, or specialized equipment. If I had a hovercraft to help us out right now.... Right now at home there are people both snowmobiling and boating. I can take a picture from my parents' house with a boat here and, about two miles back, a snowmobile.

We face a lot of challenges and we need the help. We need the finances. We need the territorial and provincial governments to come in and help us. We've been doing okay up until now, but we can save a lot more lives if we have the proper gear.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Thank you very much, Ms. Idlout.

We'll go to a quick second round. We'll start with Mr. Shields.

Mr. Shields, you have five minutes.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Quickly to the professor, you mentioned a very specific number of military. You talked about 2,000. How would you see that deployed?

[Dr. Christian Leuprecht]

When the Canadian Armed Forces go on domestic operations, there are three demands that tend to show up: general labour, expert capacity—we saw this during the pandemic health serve—and lift capacity, so air force. This is why, on the military side, the air force needs to be heavily represented—I think about 1,000 regular forces and 1,000 reserves, with an important range or component.

For instance, you heard mention here of “community safety officers”. I can see all those folks being integrated into this permanent force because not everybody needs to be at NDHQ here in Ottawa. To the contrary, you want a distributed force that is nonetheless able to plan.

You heard about the round table. What does the round table do? It's the same problem that we have here in Ottawa when we invoke the federal emergency response plan. Half the people around the table have no idea what the plan is or how you actually make it work.

You get people around the table, and you practice this. You practice some of the large emergencies so that, when people have to work together, you have the communities and you have the people who've all gotten to know each other. They've done the tabletop exercises, and they know how to roll things out. This is when you hear how saving a few minutes here or there.... This is what it comes down to in terms of these tabletop exercises.

I think this is why a permanent structure.... The challenges that you heard outlined will continue to grow with climate change because the land is changing rapidly, so if you have a permanent force structure, you now have people who can actively, permanently, dedicate their efforts to that.

If you look at the eight missions of the Canadian Armed Forces, five of them are international missions, and three of them are domestic. We have a dedicated force structure for search and rescue. Why do we not have a dedicated force structure, for instance, for domestic operations emergency response? Are the lives of northerners not as important as our commitment to the UN, NATO and other types of international operations?

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

What you're suggesting is that Alert Bay is not the answer.

On the tabletop exercises and the plans that we talk about—having been involved in many tabletops and developed many plans—if you go into many places, you get a pile of dust off them, so then how critical is it, that tabletop exercise?

[Dr. Christian Leuprecht]

I think what we heard here is that the tabletop exercise can allow us, for instance.... This is also stakeholder and community engagement. It allows us to identify what the items are that are missing locally. Yes, we can't provide all the equipment in one go, but we can actually develop a plan. The chances are that for different communities it will be different items, and the local communities will tell you “this is what we urgently need in our neighbourhood.”

If we coordinate this and we have a broader response, then we actually know where all these assets are. Currently, we don't even have a federal national register of where all these assets are distributed. If we have a major response, how do we actually want to get specialized expertise, for instance, in the way that other federal countries do? Australia does have that capacity in the state emergency services. It is imperative for Canada to be able to build that capacity.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you. I appreciate it.

Mr. Pedersen, having just heard that answer.... For you to implement, you mentioned that your number one goal was the responsibility to build capacity. Why hasn't that happened?

[Calvin Aivgak Pedersen]

It's mainly lack of funding, I believe. We have been doing this on our own, and I believe many other communities are the same way. We saw a problem. We came up with solutions on our own. We tackled this on our own because we are so far up north. It took me three days to get here by aircraft and six days waiting for weather. We'll get this job done on our own, really.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

What you're saying is that you have the capacity to do it, but you lack the resources to implement it, so you use the tools you have at hand. Whether it's a rock instead of a hammer, that's what you do.

[Calvin Aivgak Pedersen]

We get the job done with the very little resources we have.

If we do have help, we can do a lot better. We can cut down the times. We can actually cut down searches, rescues and things like that.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

When you talk about getting geared up, have there been lists of equipment identified, submitted and requested?

[Calvin Aivgak Pedersen]

They've been identified, but I don't know about requested.

Yes, we have come up with a few things that would really benefit the searches. As I was mentioning, dry suits to be wearing right now and a hovercraft would be great—one that's capable of holding a stretcher and a few rescuers. Specialized equipment such as that would greatly affect the times and results.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

What does it do to the mentality of the volunteers when they know that kind of quality would be available compared to what they have now? What does it do to the mental state of people who know they have less equipment than what could be? How does that affect them?

[Calvin Aivgak Pedersen]

We get the job done one way or another. We don't have the tools, but all we think about is, “Let's go and find this person.”

We're not worried about what machine we're using or what gear we're using. All we're worried about is, “Let's get there, let's get there now and let's find this person and bring them back home.”

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Thank you, Mr. Shields.

Next is Mr. Weiler.

[Patrick Weiler, Liberal, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Also, thank you to the witnesses for being here today and for your great testimony to this point.

My first question is for Ms. Cardinal.

So far in this study we've heard from witnesses about how traditional practices are being followed with matters in wildfire risk management, such as fuel management, and also in doing emergency response plans that prioritize protection of certain culturally important areas. You mentioned that as one of your first recommendations: embedding cultural safety into the design of your programs.

I was hoping that you could expand on what that means for the Canadian Red Cross.

[Shelley Cardinal]

When we look at cultural safety within the extensive work we do across Canada and with many indigenous communities, there are actually very specific elements that really help us to create greater cultural safety. One is how we be an ally in the best way we possibly can. That is standing with the community as opposed to either standing over a community or making decisions for a community.

One aspect of cultural safety that we realize is critical is understanding the reality within the community, so understanding historical harm and the current challenges that the community is actually facing. Over this past year as there have been children discovered around residential schools, one of the things we have found is that at times of natural disasters where there has been an environmental crisis in communities, where communities are also impacted by those social crises that are really coming forward, stress moves to distress quicker. That just happens.

By us understanding what is actually happening with a community, the barriers with a community and when a community is facing greater challenges around trauma and different aspects of their history or imposed systems—things that really impose on culture—then it becomes more socially challenging for a community so there needs to be additional support. There needs to be additional mental health support, psychosocial support, and that needs to be in a culturally attuned and culturally aware way. Too often, when it comes to programs or response, there is a space where the community members have to become the educators to those who are helping with a community challenge. Where community members are needing to educate when they're in a space of crisis, it just adds to the stress with community members.

All of those things contribute in much greater ways to working in a culturally safe way.

[Patrick Weiler, Liberal, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you for that.

My next question I'd like to ask is for Mr. Pedersen.

First, I'd like to thank you for your service and the incredible amount of territory you've covered. I just have a great appreciation for the work that search and rescue volunteers do right across the country, oftentimes operating on a shoestring budget with, as you mentioned, challenges with equipment.

I'm just curious. You mentioned that you had some support from some of the natural resource projects in the past. How has the equipment that you do have access to been funded to this point?

[Calvin Aivgak Pedersen]

I'm guessing that about 90% of the equipment has been purchased through fundraising by local efforts of literally holding bingos and local fundraising events like that. We do get donations a couple of times a year from the local hamlet and community members through radio talk shows and that kind of thing during the Christmas.... Most of it comes from the people, I think.

Regarding the natural resources, that's drying up. That mine has closed down, I think, so we are basically back to making the money on our own. It's just mostly fundraising.

[Patrick Weiler, Liberal, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you for sharing that.

One of the recommendations you had was on setting up a round table with federal and territorial counterparts. I was wondering if you could shed some light on what you foresee such a process looking like.

[Calvin Aivgak Pedersen]

It would be much like this one right here, I imagine. It would be a whole bunch of us sitting around a big table and sharing our ideas and thoughts about ways to reduce times and to reduce actual searches and rescues. Like I said earlier, many heads equal many ideas, and if we could hash out all these things and come up with a bunch of solutions together, we will save more lives.