Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on March 27th, 2023

[Rebecca Mearns]

Thank you.

I'd have to agree with Shelagh as well. There's no simple answer to it, but I think the more investment we make in education—whether that be at the K-to-12 level or within the post-secondary education programs we see, as I've discussed today, and whether it be in infrastructure or program delivery or student supports—the greater an increase in success where we put that investment we are going to see.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jenica Atwin]

Thank you, Mrs. Gill.

We'll proceed now to Ms. Idlout for six minutes.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

[Member spoke in Inuktitut, interpreted as follows:]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I thank the witnesses for their presentations.

It is wonderful to hear about the successes you have shared with us, and I have heard about the success rate. You mentioned Naujaat as one of the communities in which the teacher education program is being taught. I know there are many struggles that students face anywhere up north. There are housing issues.

My question is this: When you accept students into the teacher education program, how do you deal with the struggles they face when they move?

Thank you.

[Rebecca Mearns]

[Witness spoke in Inuktitut, interpreted as follows:]

Thank you for your question.

The students from smaller communities don't have access to social assistance. It is harder for them to get social assistance.

[English]

The way we work within the programs, we have to ensure that they have the same accessibility you would see in our regional campuses, but it's not always at par. Part of the work we are doing is to try to increase the number of student supports we have and to support our students even if it comes down to food insecurity within their home. Obviously, many of our students are reliant upon student funding, student financial assistance, while they're attending school. We all know that the cost of living continues to increase and the cost of food continues to increase, so when you're living with a family in a smaller community where those food costs are so high, we're trying to ensure we have those supports available for them too.

Our students come from many walks of life, from many home situations. Ensuring that we have adequate mental health supports in place for them as well is also a challenge within some of the smaller communities.

These are things we're constantly reviewing. We're looking at them and trying to figure out how we can make them more accessible. We can make the programs accessible, but if they don't have the supports in place, then that's going to impact how they make it through those four to five years of study.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

[Member spoke in Inuktitut, interpreted as follows:]

Thank you for your response.

One of the really grey areas is where the Nunavut Arctic College gets their funding from. Where are the students who are attending the teacher education program getting their financial support from? Do they have access to those supports?

Thank you.

[Rebecca Mearns]

Qujannamilik.

The college, as I stated, is a public agency, an agency of the Government of Nunavut, so we do receive core funding through the Government of Nunavut of about $40 million, which goes towards our operations and maintenance across the territory.

We also rely on a large amount of third party funding to be able to provide additional programming. So, as I mentioned, there's the pathfinder project with funding from the federal government as well as the Government of Nunavut, and, through Makigiaqta Inuit training, funding has been received, and we rely on all of that to come together to be able to run our programs.

Our students do pay tuition, and we have set tuition amounts, obviously. If they are renting student housing units, they pay rent to the college as well. Those are the main sources of revenue. For our students, when they are attending, many are reliant on financial assistance for Nunavut students, which is a funding body that is out of the Department of Education, which provides funding for post-secondary training. Some of our students receive funding through adult learning and training, which is funding delivered through the Department of Family Services—and those are for other non-designated, post-secondary programs.

The funding amounts are set by those bodies, and they provide the funding directly to the students, not only for their tuition but also for their monthly living allowances and travel, if they have to travel to attend a program.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jenica Atwin]

Thank you, Ms. Idlout.

We do have time for a condensed, second round.

We'll be going to Mr. Melillo for five minutes.

[Eric Melillo, Conservative, Kenora, ON]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Thank you to all of our witnesses for joining us to be part of this important discussion.

I think I'll probably focus completely on you, Ms. Osborne, from Keewaytinook Internet High School.

I want to thank you for taking the time to travel down here and be a part of this, and thank you for the work that you do across my riding and northern Ontario. As you know, it's incredibly important, and I've appreciated the opportunity to join and be a part of some of your graduation ceremonies in the past. It's great to see some of the successes you've had.

You spoke about many important things. I hope we get a chance to get to them, but broadly, you mentioned the unnecessary barriers that need to be broken down to help improve graduation rates. One of the great things that I think your school brings is keeping people in their home communities, which I think is incredibly important. We've heard about it countless times at this table. If we can prevent people from going to Sioux Lookout, Thunder Bay or some of the other larger centres, it's obviously going to be a lot easier for them to learn. To that end, obviously an Internet high school requires Internet, and, as you know, that's not always something that's reliable across our region.

I want to start with that, because there's a recent Auditor General's report that came out, which indicates that, as of 2021, just under 43% of first nation communities across Canada had access to quality, high-speed and affordable Internet. In Ontario, that drops about 10 percentage points to around 33% for those who don't have access to that Internet.

I guess this is a long way of asking if you can shed some light for us on how that impacts the communities you work with and what should be done by the government to help support that.

[Nikki Osborne]

At an Internet high school, the Internet is crucial. Now, we're really creative. We all have tools in our tool box for when the Internet goes down. We know how to keep our students productive.

The Internet is important for so many reasons such as access to information, access to quality speakers and access to role models. Our school has been lucky to partner with many organizations, including Takingitglobal and Connected North. You can ask me about that afterwards.

As we look forward after high school, we see that more and more post-secondary institutions are offering programs online. We know that COVID has shown us that more and more careers can be done remotely, and there are more and more digital careers. If we look at graduation rates, if we look at unemployment and if we look at access to mental health services and medical appointments, the Internet is a huge investment, but I promise you, it's worth it. It's going to tick off so many boxes.

[Eric Melillo, Conservative, Kenora, ON]

I really appreciate that.

In your opening remarks, you laid out a lot of very exciting things about your school and things that you're working on. I want to ask you about as many of them as I can. One that stood out to me is the six different languages being offered. Could you share with us how that process has come to be and how the government could better support that and hopefully replicate it across other jurisdictions as well?

[Nikki Osborne]

Absolutely.

We offer three different languages in six different courses. We have Oji-Cree level one and level two, Cree level one and level two, and Ojibway level one and level two. We have a fantastic native language teacher. She has her own courses, obviously, but she does work with all our teachers. We offer 80 different courses, and she helps us infuse native indigenous languages into our lessons and into our daily conversation with students to help reinforce their language and to make and keep those connections.

[Eric Melillo, Conservative, Kenora, ON]

I appreciate that.

I probably have time for one more quick question, if the chair doesn't cut me off.

You also mentioned how important early learning is. Again, that's something that we've heard quite a bit from other witnesses as well. Could you reinforce that and maybe contextualize it a little bit more for us?

[Nikki Osborne]

I'm a high school teacher, but I worked at the Deer Lake elementary school for four years. The greater impact is going to happen at the elementary school level. To be honest with you, I do not want my job as a graduation coach to exist in 20 years. I don't want there to be a need for it. We shouldn't be playing catch-up.

Let's help students at the right age, at those early ages, so that they experience success early. It's not fair for these students to go through their entire schooling career with huge gaps. They internalize these failures. It's so much harder for them. It's not fair. It's not right.

I promise that if we invest early in childhood education, and if we offer supports to families that are struggling, that will make a huge difference in these statistics and in the lives of these students and their families.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jenica Atwin]

Thank you, Mr. Melillo.

We'll go to Mr. Weiler for five minutes.

[Patrick Weiler, Liberal, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

I thank the witnesses for being here today.

My first question is for you, Ms. Osborne. I know that you gave a lot of different prompts for questions to ask you, but as a graduation coach, what questions and concerns are you getting most often from students who are looking to pursue post-secondary education?

[Nikki Osborne]

There's a huge “What next?” factor. The students at our school have chosen to stay in their home communities to finish high school. There is the option to go out to these bigger cities. Students who have chosen to stay in their communities want to be home. They want to be with their families. Frankly, there are not enough employment opportunities within their communities.

It can be daunting to finish high school with me and then have to look for opportunities outside their communities for post-secondary education. What's next after that? How are they able to work in industries that they feel passionate about when they want to be with families and they want to be around their culture? That's what I see most often.

[Patrick Weiler, Liberal, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

To follow up on that, what opportunities do you see most often for that post-secondary education following graduation?

[Nikki Osborne]

In most communities, the schools would be hiring, the health offices, or the band, and there is a desperate need for skilled trades in our northern communities. That is a huge area of growth that we need to support in high schools and post-secondary institutions. We shouldn't be having to fly up skilled labourers to fix furnaces or fix roofs. We shouldn't be flying in people to repair the vehicles and other equipment used to maintain the airports.

There are people who want to work and want to stay in their communities. They love working with their hands, but there's definitely a gap. There's a gap there.

[Patrick Weiler, Liberal, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you for that, Ms. Osborne.

Next I'd like to ask a couple of questions of Ms. Rowles.

Your opening remarks were really interesting. You mentioned that a lot of your work in Yukon University is with indigenous people. I was hoping you could explain to this committee how you see the process of decolonizing education and how this might be able to be applied to other educational institutions across Canada.

[Dr. Shelagh Rowles]

Certainly, the process of decolonizing education comes from so many different levels. One thing we're really proud of is that it even comes to our legislation.

Our legislation requires us to be working...there's a legal requirement for us to be working with Yukon first nations and ensuring that the students have successful outcomes. Part of our funding, and the determination of the Yukon government in our success as a post-secondary, will be dependent on the feedback and the success rates of first nations students, or indigenous students in Yukon. It's specifically first nations students, though.

We have introduced a whole variety of programs that have come through at the request of Yukon first nations. We have something called a president's advisory committee on first nations initiatives. That committee has representation from each of the 14 first nations in the territory, as well as some of the neighbouring communities. There are some from the Gwich'in Tribal Council over in the Mackenzie-Delta area, as well as from Lower Post over in B.C. and Atlin, B.C.

We're really trying to ensure that we hear the priorities and the interests of the first nations. Through that, we have responded as far as introducing different types of student supports is concerned. We have introduced first nations navigators to be able to provide that holisitic support to students within the university, but we have also introduced programs that were truly co-created.

I would say the environmental monitoring is one example of when mining companies wanted us to have an environmental monitoring program. That's a fiduciary requirement of theirs, but first nations said they really want their interests to be paramount, and for any graduates coming out of those programs to really understand what an environmental monitor should be doing from their perspective. We found that to be such an amazing model in that a number of the graduates from the program have gone on to work in the lands departments of the first nations governments and, in some cases, are directors of lands in the governments.

I think in the last question period I referenced the indigenous governance program. That's another one that was co-created. The question of having the program came from first nations as they were establishing their new governments. They really understood the important role of policy and how important oversight and broad governance are to sustainability in the future of those governments. With that, we created the degree where we find they will be honest about challenges—

[The Chair, Liberal, Jenica Atwin]

Ms. Rowles, I'm so sorry. I have to cut you off for time. Perhaps you can continue in the next response.

Thank you very much.

Mrs. Gill, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

We will have to suspend briefly to figure out the technical difficulty.

We will go to Madam Idlout, for two and a half minutes, and then we will come back to Madame Gill.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

[Member spoke in Inuktitut, interpreted as follows:]

I have some questions for you, Becky.

The first question is about the funding that you mentioned. Is it adequate funding for Nunavut Arctic College? Is it adequate for the teacher education program? That is my first question.

If you could, please also reiterate or speak a little more about the cultural learning institute that you have there.

Thank you.

[Rebecca Mearns]

Qujannamiik

As far as the funding is concerned, we have enough funds to operate within what we're doing, but there is more need when it comes to our student supports and to infrastructure funding. That's really where we're lacking at the moment, whether that be for physical buildings, housing and things like that, as well as Internet and accessibility.

We are always looking to see how we increase, whether it be person years within the college or funding for programming; hence, why we're receiving a lot of third party funding right now. We've identified areas where we need additional funding for those programs, and that work is ongoing. There is still an ongoing need to increase the funding we have for student supports. Part of what we recognize too is that we're providing mental health support. We're providing food support, and things like that. These are all things that are impacted by life at home, so if you're in overcrowded housing, if you are food insecure, if you have other issues going on within the home, that's impacting your life at school...and that's where we need more funding within the college, within our schools, within our communities overall.

The second piece you wanted me to speak to was our cultural school. It's named Piqqusilirivvik, located at Clyde River. There is a question about decolonization within education and I think this is really a wonderful example of that, and a really wonderful place to visit if you're ever looking to go somewhere else to learn more about how Inuit teach. Piqqusilirivvik is run fully in Inuktut. It's run through cultural programming. The students do research. They spend time out on the land. They hunt. They build things. They learn to sew. They learn to build tools and they learn to utilize those tools on the land. It is a genuinely Inuit-built, Inuit way of knowing, way of being and way of teaching that is utilized at that school and it's an absolutely incredible place. It's an amazing place to go to see the growth that can happen within our students when they're allowed to live within their language, within their culture, and to be able to learn from elders and knowledge keepers around them.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

Qujannamiik.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jenica Atwin]

Thank you, Ms. Idlout.

Perhaps Ms. Gill is okay.

Is Mrs. Gill with us?