Industry and Technology Committee on Oct. 27th, 2025

[Karim Bardeesy, Liberal, Taiaiako'n—Parkdale—High Park, ON]

I'll stick with you, Mr. Adams.

With respect to one of your members, Toyota Canada, their August 2025 sales were up 14.4% year over year with electrified vehicles representing 49.1% of all units sold.

What is it about the shift to EV over the longer term that you think is attracting Toyota?

[David Adams]

I think Toyota has actually been criticized by some of the environmental zealots for not moving fast enough on EVs. I think this is part of the challenge for all manufacturers. I would come back to the question as to what the government's goal is. Is it to reduce greenhouse gas emissions, or is it put a certain type of product on the road?

My members generally, especially the Japanese, are very thoughtful—not to say that others aren't—and very deliberate in terms of thinking through things before they act, but when they act, they move with swiftness.

What I can say is that, to your point, right now, Toyota has seen a significant sales increase, and they also will be moving to add the 2026 RAV4 hybrid production. That will be coming out in Woodstock and Cambridge in December.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Thank you very much, Mr. Bardeesy.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Mr. Ste‑Marie, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Karim Bardeesy, Liberal, Taiaiako'n—Parkdale—High Park, ON]

Thank you.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Thank you.

My question is for the witnesses from the three organizations. Right now, the American president is angry because the American public has been reminded that Ronald Reagan was against tariffs and for free trade. As a result, he announced an additional 10% tariff on everything, but there is still no order in council.

If there were an order in council for an additional 10% tariff, what would the short-term consequences be for the members of your respective organizations?

You have 30 seconds each to respond.

[Brian Kingston]

It would be extremely challenging if more tariffs go into place, particularly if they apply to products that currently qualify under USMCA.

We don't know yet how these will be applied, but an additional 10% is.... Again, it will be billions of dollars in cost to this sector and other Canadian sectors, so it's very damaging. Hopefully we can find an off-ramp.

[Charles Bernard]

Quickly, as Mr. Kingston just mentioned, we don't yet have clear details on how these tariffs will be applied, if at all. However, it doesn't take a genius to see the impact this would have on consumers at a time when the cost-of-living crisis, which is already making it difficult to afford these vehicles, is already quite acute.

In 2021, according to the figures I have, the monthly payment amounted to $715; right now, it's nearly $870 or $880. The cost of living crisis is having a significant negative impact on consumers, both in terms of the cost of these vehicles and their access. Tariffs are a tax on consumers. Logically, a 10% increase in tariffs would only worsen this situation.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Adams, would you like to add anything? If an additional 10% tariff were applied, what would that mean for your members?

[David Adams]

I would just echo the comments of my colleagues.

We don't know what it's going to be applicable to yet. I think the reality for the automotive sector is we've been.... Because of the CUSMA-USMCA and because the American content of vehicles built in Canada is considered, we have had some of the tariff impact ameliorated. However, it just shows you, again, the lack of certainty that we're dealing with when a comment can be made one night to increase tariffs. What tariff? When? We don't know those details.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Thank you very much.

Madam Dancho, you have five minutes.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to focus a bit more on what we need for certainty. Again, I think the point that Mr. Falk was making is well placed. There were big promises made by the Carney government over the last election when Canadians were going to the polls—big, big promises about deals being made. We heard over and over again that something was going to happen in the summer, and it didn't happen.

Mr. Williams, you alluded to something that was supposed to happen around Labour Day weekend. That didn't happen.

Very big promises were made that would have delivered certainty, had they come through. Unfortunately, Mr. Carney's promises did not come to fruition, so it does add to the uncertainty that your businesses are experiencing.

Mr. Kingston, regarding the Brampton plant, first you said that there are plans for Brampton—I appreciate that—but later you said, "We need market certainty so that companies can continue with investments. When you think about an automotive plant like we have in Brampton...these are long-term investments.... We need certainty on the trade front. Then companies can proceed with decisions with respect to the Canadian footprint. As long as that uncertainty hangs over, it will make it very challenging.”

To me, that sounds like you're saying there could be plans for Brampton if we get a deal, and not just any deal but a good deal for us to stay with Brampton. Is that an accurate assessment of what you said collectively?

[Brian Kingston]

Yes. Brampton is not closed. The company does have plans for that plant, but yes, we do need clarity in terms of what the trade environment is going to look like.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

If we don't get a deal, a long-promised deal that has yet to come from Mr. Carney and the Liberal government, are you saying that, in a year from now, if all things are the same, you're not going to have anything moving there?

I'm just looking for a clear answer.

[Brian Kingston]

I don't want to make a judgment call on a hypothetical, but if we don't get a trade agreement with the United States, it won't just be the auto industry that will be in dire straits; the whole Canadian economy will be at risk.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

I certainly appreciate that.

Again, as I mentioned, there have been rumours about a potential deal on steel and aluminum, which, of course, are inputs into cars. That would be great, but there are still no deliverables yet on that. We have not heard that same emphasis from the Liberal government about the auto sector. That's very concerning to us for all the workers who are waiting. We need that certainty, and I'm sure you would all agree. Hopefully, we can have a bit of a reset from the Liberals and have them publicly say they're working behind the scenes to get an auto deal. We have not heard that so far. Based on what you've said, that doesn't bode well for what we're seeing in Brampton.

I want to change gears and focus on Mr. Williams.

You mentioned that these EV mandates in essence represent money going from Canada to companies like Tesla. For someone who's not familiar with how the mandate works, are you saying the Liberal government's EV mandate enriches companies like Tesla rather than our own?

[Huw Williams]

Yes. Tesla is the only car company operating in Canada that doesn't use a dealer network. All of our dealers are independently owned franchises. We buy the cars from the manufacturers in advance, pay for them and then hope to sell them to consumers. We're on the hook for all of that. Tesla has a direct-to-consumer model. They are the biggest beneficiary and have been the biggest beneficiary. They get the subsidy on the front end from the iZEV subsidy, as every manufacturer does, but then, to be able to buy credits to meet the mandate, other manufacturers are buying credits to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars for a future EV mandate from Tesla. Tesla is getting paid on both ends, and we don't have to look too far to know how productive they are in terms of the Canada-U.S. relationship.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

It's pretty shocking to me to understand that this EV mandate, although I recognize it's temporarily paused, is still hanging over everybody's head. What we've heard clearly today is that is the last thing we need for investment certainty into Canada, given everything else that's going on. Very clearly, for the most part, you've all outlined that if we could do away with the mandate, it would provide us with more of the certainty we desperately need in this country. We're bleeding automotive jobs here, and not just the direct jobs but all the indirect jobs. I believe the Brampton plant, for example, is responsible for 12,000 indirect jobs that play into that plant, so having things like this hanging over our heads is pretty significant.

Mr. Williams, I think what you're saying is accurate. Not only is the EV mandate driving uncertainty but it is also enriching companies like Tesla that really don't employ anyone in Canada. Is that accurate?

[Huw Williams]

Canadians would be shocked by the shell game that Tesla is playing to benefit from subsidies on both ends of the equation. It's shocking. We find it shocking.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Thank you very much.

For the last 20 seconds, I'll go to Mr. Kingston on the certainty question.

How important is it for our job certainty in Canada that we get a deal?

[Brian Kingston]

It's critical. It's at the centre of everything. If we don't get a trade agreement with the Americans, there's no certainty for existing or future investment decisions in the Canadian economy. We have no choice. We have to get back to the table and strike a deal.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Bains, you have five minutes.

[Parm Bains, Liberal, Richmond East—Steveston, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to our witnesses for joining us today and for your hard work fighting for this industry and the families who are impacted by it.

I'll go to Mr. Williams.

On the issue of EV mandates, you indicated that my home province of British Columbia hasn't paused the EV mandate, whereas the federal government has.

Have you had conversations with them? What are the B.C. dealers' thoughts on this? Why is B.C. not following suit to support the industry like the federal government is and the Prime Minister is?