Industry and Technology Committee on Nov. 26th, 2025

[Ted Falk, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Okay, thank you.

I have a follow-up question.

As you know, we had L3Harris here at committee speaking to these same issues on procurement. They have a fighter aircraft depot in Mirabel, Quebec, where much of our RCAF fleet is currently being maintained, and they employ many high-skilled Quebeckers.

L3Harris identified they are a strategic partner in the F-35 procurement. It looks as though, if everything comes through the way it was initially discussed, there will be a regional repair centre for the F-35, which means there will be a lot of F-35s coming into Mirabel—not just our own country's F-35s but also those coming from other countries.

What would be the impact on the Quebec aerospace industry if the Canadian government were to fail to follow through on the F-35 purchase commitments, and what are your members saying?

[Mélanie Lussier]

L3Harris was very clear on the impact that not doing the full procurement on the F-35 would have. They put numbers forward—for example, 1,400 employees. It's not layoffs they're talking about; it's maybe less growth in their company. I'm not going to comment on specific contracts.

The thing is, if they cannot repair and service the F-35, L3Harris also has the ability to provide service and overhauls for other aircraft. They're doing the F-18 right now in Mirabel. There's the potential for them to take on the F-35, which was guaranteed, but if there's another contender, they could also do it with other clients.

For sure, maintenance and overhaul are an important portion of the Quebec business. It's a strategic field we have here, not only with L3Harris but with other companies as well, such as Avianor. Maintenance on helicopters is done at Bell Textron Canada. It's a skill set we have in Mirabel for sure.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Mr. Falk, there are about 15 seconds left if you want to fire one off real quick.

[Ted Falk, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Yes, I'll fire off a real quick one.

Are your other members concerned about the potential loss of the F-35 purchase?

[Mélanie Lussier]

I'll go back to my first intervention. At Aéro Montréal, we refrain from talking about specific contracts. That's the way we've always worked. Maybe some talk about it behind closed doors individually and have individual opinions, but not as a cluster. I don't represent the sum of opinions; I represent the consensus. We have always said we're not going to take a side in any procurement contracts.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Thanks, Mr. Falk.

Mr. Bains, go ahead.

[Parm Bains, Liberal, Richmond East—Steveston, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to our witnesses for joining us today.

I'm going to direct my question to Mr. Vandenberg.

I represent Richmond, British Columbia, a coastal area where we have a strong marine sector. BC Coast Pilots has been serving there for over 50 years now.

Can you please inform this committee about the necessity of having a well-trained community of mariners? How can this impact, maintain and defend Canadian sovereignty, particularly in the Arctic?

[John Vandenberg]

I think we can say that a strong nation has a strong navy and a strong navy needs recruits.

We get out to small communities. You identified the west coast of Canada. I believe that about 50% of the mariners in Canada are working on the west coast right now. Many are working on the east coast—about 25% to 30%—and the rest are distributed on the lakes, with some in the Arctic.

In order to build a workforce for the future, we have to get into the schools early and we have to start planting the seed in young people's heads that this is an option for them. We run into a lot of people. We go to schools and out to the communities. They're actually looking at us and saying, “Isn't that interesting? Is this something I could do?” They aren't even aware of the possibilities and opportunities in an industry that's crying out for people.

I don't know if that partly answers your question.

By the way, we recently signed an agreement with the Coast Guard Academy to be a satellite campus for them in the western Arctic. We're looking forward to that relationship and to building on that relationship with DND, with the RCN, potentially with the Raven program, with the rangers and with others.

I spoke not long ago in Yellowknife at the Joint Task Force North's Arctic security working group conference. I explained our whole position on how this could support defence and recruitment in the north.

It's a long answer, but I got it in.

[Parm Bains, Liberal, Richmond East—Steveston, BC]

It's a good one.

You've talked about collaboration and looking at search and rescue and all of the other service providers that are so important to our coastal regions.

Can you talk a bit about how private capital can be utilized in this sector better? You've talked a lot about the Coast Guard and the RCMP. A lot of these are federal institutions.

With the largest buyer for the defence industry being the public sector, how can private sector funding or investments be made to strengthen the industry?

[John Vandenberg]

With respect to our industry, I won't speak of what I don't know; I'll speak about the marine education industry.

Certainly, the industry is willing to step up. We need the industry to invest in education to share the cost of education in order to find personnel for their fleets for the future.

Right now, our small institution is primarily publicly funded, but there is a revenue model going forward. Having been in business for only two years, we need to monetize this. We need to establish a P and L stream just as any privately funded institution would.

There is a place for private industry to step up. I've noticed that private industry has stepped up for other institutions. They recognize the need. I think there's an opportunity and obligation for them to invest here.

[Parm Bains, Liberal, Richmond East—Steveston, BC]

If I have time, I'll sneak in a little question for Madame Lussier.

Can you inform the committee of what ways the U.S. tariffs are affecting the aerospace sector? Much like the marine sector, my hometown of Richmond, British Columbia, has a very strong aerospace sector also. I'm curious about your thoughts on this.

[Mélanie Lussier]

Customs duties really affected us at first, creating uncertainty. It's important to note that the aerospace sector is currently covered by the rules of origin of the Canada-United States-Mexico Agreement, or CUSMA.

Companies have to demonstrate that aerospace parts crossing the border comply with the rules—I must reiterate this several times—before the parts can be installed on a finished aeroplane or helicopter. If they comply with the CUSMA rules of origin, they are not subject to duties.

However, this entails a lot of administrative work, especially for SMEs, who have said that these tasks account for up to 10% of productivity losses related to customs duties. As a result, customs duties are not the primary challenge as they are generally avoidable in most cases. The real obstacle is the administrative burden tied to refund claims and related tasks.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Thank you, Mr. Bains.

Mr. Ste‑Marie, did you hear what I said at the beginning of the hour?

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

You have the floor for about a minute.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Thank you.

In one minute, Ms. Proulx, can you tell us why the industrial and technological benefits policy needs to be modernized?

[Véronique Proulx]

First, we need to ensure that we are getting more bang for our buck. When we award a contract to a foreign company, we want to make sure there will be greater benefits for Quebec and Canada.

Second, it must be well-intentioned. We must ensure that the money that comes back here is redistributed to funds and companies that will continue to develop their expertise and new defence-related products and services.

These companies will, of course, be able to meet the needs of the Canadian market. They will then be able to develop their exports. That is how we will succeed in creating wealth in this country. Currently, the industrial benefits program is not being used to its full potential in the aerospace, transportation and naval sectors. This program really needs to be reviewed.

Our coalition is proposing that the government bring together experts it can work with to determine the criteria and parameters that need change so that this program serves Quebeckers and Canadians first.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Thank you very much, Mr. Ste‑Marie.

Witnesses, thank you very much for being here today.

We are grateful for your testimonies.

Colleagues, that marks the end of the defence industrial strategy study we're undertaking. We extended the meeting, but I'm going to suspend for just one minute just to make sure we can get everything in order, and then we'll go on.

Witnesses, you are dismissed, and I hope you have a wonderful evening.

Colleagues, I'm suspending just briefly, and then we'll get into our affairs.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Colleagues, we created a bit of space at the end of the meeting, and I appreciate the collaboration, because it meant we could effectively and efficiently undertake our study without dipping into time for witnesses. We're doing all of this in good faith.

Madam Dancho, I will recognize you. The floor is yours, as I believe you have a motion or more to present to us.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I have a very important motion to move and discuss today. The motion is as follows:

That the committee report to the House that it condemns the unjustified American tariffs on the Canadian auto sector, and that it calls upon the government to live up to its promise made during the election to negotiate a win for the workers whose livelihoods depend on a good deal for Canada.

Just to be clear, the objectives of this motion are threefold.

The first is that the Standing Committee on Industry and Technology send a formally reported notice to the House that we condemn the American auto tariffs. I think that would send a very strong signal coming from this powerful standing committee.

Second, we call on the Liberal government to fulfill its promise and deliver a good deal for auto workers. I think that's perfectly reasonable.

Third and very critically, if this motion passes today, it will allow an opportunity for the House of Commons to formally debate what's happening to the Canadian auto sector. That is a very critical piece of this motion.

Just for the committee's awareness, I want to outline the magnitude of what we're facing in this country, given the U.S. tariffs on the Canadian auto sector.

The auto sector contributes about $14 billion to the Canadian GDP. Every job in automotive assembly supports about nine additional jobs, the highest external benefit multiplier of any sector in Canada. That's coming right from the Centre for Automotive Research and Education. About 92% of motor vehicle exports go to the U.S., and that access is critical to the success of the Canadian auto market. Motor vehicles are Canada's second-largest export.

The Canadian Vehicle Manufacturers' Association has said that auto manufacturing accounts for well over 105,600 direct jobs, so well over 100,000 jobs are in the firing line, so to speak, of these auto tariffs. The majority of these jobs are located in Ontario, as we know. The auto industry is responsible for well over 603,500 direct and indirect jobs across Canada. Well over 600,000 jobs are being directly hit by these tariffs, being impacted. Of course, we have seen significant losses starting to happen.

This is just a few months in. Conservatives are deeply concerned by what we'll be talking about a month from now, six months from now, a year from now.

Just to remind the committee, GM's CAMI plant in Ingersoll has lost about 500 jobs. At GM's plant in Oshawa, Unifor has said that over 750 workers will be laid off, in addition to about 1,500 jobs along the supply chain. One direct auto job loss means more indirect jobs lost as well.

We've talked about Stellantis and what's happening in Brampton at length at this committee. That's 3,000 people who have been laid off, with no promise of them returning without a good deal in the auto industry from the Liberal government. Also, at Paccar Inc., in Sainte-Thérèse, Quebec, a further 725 jobs were lost. Again, every auto sector job directly lost means more indirect jobs are in the firing line.

We believe as Conservatives that this is a critical motion to put forward to send a clear signal not only to the House of Commons but across the country that this is where we stand. Further to that, as I said, it will provide an opportunity for the House of Commons to debate and further discuss this issue. I find it very surprising that, given the job losses and damage it is doing to the Canadian economy, it hasn't been debated on the floor of the House of Commons.

Our goal is to send a clear message that we support the auto sector. We're calling on the Liberal government to deliver on its promises, but we also feel that this issue is so critical that it must be debated on the floor of the House of Commons. Passing this motion today will provide us the opportunity to have it on the floor.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Thank you, Madam Dancho.

Colleagues, I will go over the order I'm keeping so that everybody knows it.

We will start with Mr. Ste‑Marie, followed by Ms. Borrelli, Mr. Guglielmin, Ms. Kirkland, Mr. Noormohamed, Mr. Danko and, finally, Mr. Bardeesy.

Mr. Ste‑Marie, you have the floor.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I support the motion for the reasons mentioned earlier regarding the seriousness of the issue. Since I would like to include what is happening at the PACCAR plant, as Ms. Dancho mentioned in her explanation, I would like to propose an amendment that I hope will be a favourable amendment that can be supported by all colleagues, whether we are in favour of the motion or not.

I will state my amendment in French and English, and I will send the written version by email, if necessary.

I propose that, after “That the committee report to the House that it condemns the unjustified American tariffs on the Canadian auto sector”, we add “and that of heavy vehicles”. This would allow us to include what is happening at PACCAR.

In English, the addition would be after “the Canadian auto sector”.

We will add that.

“and that of heavy vehicles”.

I hope it will be a favourable amendment and that everyone will support it.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Mr. Ste‑Marie, did you send a copy of this amendment to the members of the committee or the Clerk?

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

No, I haven't done that yet. I'll do it right now. I'll send it to the clerk.