Sure.
The last four years have actually been a transformation for the whole industry, and arguably a forced transformation. We hear a lot that companies haven't modernized enough or they haven't gone into enough value-added, or they haven't looked at their products and expanded, that pulp mills have been the same over the last 50 years.
I argue the point a little bit. Take New Brunswick, for example. Our pulp mills no longer produce newsprint; they're all in high-grade paper. So they've added value to their business. They're into tissues, the coated papers. They've made the transformation at hundreds of millions of dollars of cost. That has taken place.
I think that structural component is in swing. The sawmills have definitely modernized over the last couple of years. We know we could do more. The challenge is the investment component. It's easy to say we need to do more value-added and we need to get into it, but it's harder when there's no credit available and the investors aren't necessarily taking a key interest.
I believe that will turn around as the markets in Europe and South America change. I think there will be more interest. But those challenges still lie there.