Evidence of meeting #40 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was drugs.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Richard Dearden  Partner, Gowlings, As an Individual
Rachel Kiddell-Monroe  Chair, Universities Allied for Essential Medicines
Amir Attaran  Canada Research Chair, Law, Population Health, and Global Development Policy, University of Ottawa, As an Individual
Joshua Kimani  Canadian Medical Institute in Kenya, As an Individual
Frederick Abbott  Edward Ball Eminent Scholar, Professor of International Law, Florida State University College of Law, As an Individual
Linda Watson  Member, National Advocacy Committee of the Grandmothers to Grandmothers Campaign
Elizabeth Rennie  Member, National Advocacy Committee of the Grandmothers to Grandmothers Campaign
Angus Livingstone  Managing Director, University-Industry Liaison Office, University of British Columbia, As an Individual
Emilou MacLean  Director, United States of America, Campaign for Access to Essential Medicines, Doctors Without Borders
Grant Perry  Vice-President, Public Affairs/Reimbursement, GlaxoSmithKline Canada
Russell Williams  President, Canada's Research-Based Pharmaceutical Companies (Rx & D)
Laurence Dotto  Director, Government and External Affairs, Canada's Research-Based Pharmaceutical Companies (Rx & D)
Frank Plummer  Scientific Director General, National Microbiology Laboratory, Public Health Agency of Canada
Jim Keon  President, Canadian Generic Pharmaceutical Association
David Schwartz  Chair, Biotechnology Patents Committee, Intellectual Property Institute of Canada
Antony Taubman  Director, Intellectual Property Division, World Trade Organization (WTO)
Paula Akugizibwe  Advocacy Coordinator, AIDS and Rights Alliance for Southern Africa
Andrew Jenner  Director, Intellectual Property and Trade, International Federation of Pharmaceutical Manufacturers and Associations

Noon

President, Canadian Generic Pharmaceutical Association

Jim Keon

I think Apotex is a leader in Canada. It took the opportunity, the challenge, and went forward. I would say that there was tremendous enthusiasm within that company. People worked long hours, they worked weekends and evenings to try to get the product approved as quickly as possible. There was a great sense that they were doing something important when they did it.

When I talked to the Apotex executives...I think they found that the whole process was very lengthy, uncertain, and led to too-small shipments. The process would have to be started again. Apotex and other companies are able to provide good prices and volume products by being large-volume producers. They don't specialize in little shipments, buying a product or making a small amount and selling it. That's not the way to get good prices. That's not the way to develop economies of scale. If they've identified a product and work as they did in the past with Doctors Without Borders and with Health Canada, and see a need for a product that they've developed, they'd like to be able to produce that in large quantities, subject to the rules, but then sell it with some certainty. They don't have that, and that's really, I think, in large measure why they found this process unsatisfactory.

Noon

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

Thank you, Mr. Keon, and thank you, Mr. Garneau.

It looks like we may actually be aggregating some of our witnesses now. Please be patient with me for a moment, members.

Is there anybody in the room in Cape Town right now who can hear my voice and possibly come to the microphone?

Mr. Taubman, can you hear me?

12:05 p.m.

Antony Taubman Director, Intellectual Property Division, World Trade Organization (WTO)

Yes, I can. Good afternoon.

12:05 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

That's great.

Mr. Taubman, go ahead with your opening remarks, for five minutes.

12:05 p.m.

Director, Intellectual Property Division, World Trade Organization (WTO)

Antony Taubman

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Honourable members, I thank you for the invitation to appear before this committee on your deliberations on a matter of fundamental importance to the international community, that of ensuring access to vital medicines by those in most pressing need of them.

I have to say that it's unusual for someone in the WTO Secretariat to contribute to a national legislative and policy-making process in this immediate way, but I understand that some technical input from the WTO Secretariat may assist you in your deliberations, just as it was sought by the Senate Standing Committee on Banking, Trade and Commerce concerning the analogous Bill S-232, which led to an appearance before that committee in November last year.

I made an extended statement on that occasion, which is now on the record. So as not to outstay my welcome today, I would like to refer to that statement and ask, if possible, that the committee take note of the detailed clarifications and explanations concerning my status that we recorded on that occasion. However, I should reiterate that I do not appear before you as an independent expert with latitude to offer personal opinions nor as an advocate of any policy position or approach to legal interpretation. Equally, I'm not here to represent the World Trade Organization, as such. Rather, I work within the secretariat of the WTO, and I can offer input to your committee only at a technical level.

My position is something like that of the staffers, in fact, who organize and support your committee hearings, rather than that of an independent voice. I currently serve as director of the Intellectual Property Division of the WTO, where I work with a small but talented and dedicated group of colleagues responsible for the administration of the WTO Agreement on Trade-Related Aspects of Intellectual Property Rights, the TRIPS agreement. We service the TRIPS Council, a body within the WTO that comprises all of our members, that is to say, the 153 members of the WTO.

The TRIPS Council is in fact meeting right now and is just about to undertake its annual review of the paragraph 6 system you are considering in your deliberations. We also manage notifications and formal procedures under the TRIPS agreement, and we provide technical assistance and training, especially for developing countries. Again, this is an important part of our work in relation to the paragraph 6 system and public health. We do this in cooperation with our international partners, including the World Health Organization.

There are certain roles that we cannot offer you as a secretariat. Unfortunately, these may coincide with the very kinds of inputs that could be most useful to your committee. In particular, I can't offer any views on the interpretation of our legal texts—the TRIPS agreement and the amendment—and still less on the compatibility with TRIPS of any existing or proposed Canadian legislation. This position, I know, may appear to be evasive or unhelpful. I emphasize that it's emphatically not. Rather, it stems from sound policy reasons and a consensus among our members as to our appropriate role as a secretariat.

We are, however, responsible for supporting our members with respect to the appropriate way forward on the implementation of TRIPS and the paragraph 6 mechanism, and we have a responsibility to provide as much technical assistance as we can. However, our members collectively don't consider it helpful if a technical secretariat seeks to pass judgment on domestic legislative proposals or to make assessments as to whether the legislative choices comply with the TRIPS obligations in a legal sense. That's really a matter for our members to take up amongst themselves, and that's something I can elaborate on if it's useful to the committee.

There is a process of analysis and review of national legislation. Intellectual property legislation, including Canada's access to medicines regime, is normally notified to the TRIPS Council, to this formal body. The council then reviews the legislation. There is a peer review process whereby other members, other nations, raise questions about the legislation and seek clarification on it. But even the TRIPS Council itself is not empowered to then make a determination as to whether the legislation is compliant with TRIPS, even though our members have indeed, as a matter of policy, generally expressed a firm policy resolve to ensure that the legislation complies with TRIPS.

There are other processes, such as the trade policy review, that also look at aspects of the national trade regime. Indeed, Canada's most recent trade policy review in 2007 looked at the access to medicines regime, among many other aspects of Canada's laws and regulations.

However, none of these processes lead to any formal assessment of compliance with international obligations. If there are concerns about non-compliance, it's really up to another WTO member. If they happen to be sufficiently concerned to take up the matter formally, it's up to that member to follow one of several courses of action. One of these is to lodge a formal complaint, which can lead to formal disputes and proceedings. This can ultimately lead to an independent panel that will consider whether the law is consistent or not with obligations.

But the secretary itself certainly doesn't initiate any such compliant process. It really would be at odds with our essential role, and we don't offer any assistance on compliance on request or even by our initiative.

12:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

Mr. Taubman, is that just about the conclusion?

12:10 p.m.

Director, Intellectual Property Division, World Trade Organization (WTO)

Antony Taubman

Yes. I wanted to mention some of the technical cooperation relating to paragraph 6, but I'm happy to pass that up if you prefer to move on.

12:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

That would be good. Thank you very much.

I think Cape Town has joined us and Madam Akugizibwe.

12:10 p.m.

Paula Akugizibwe Advocacy Coordinator, AIDS and Rights Alliance for Southern Africa

My apologies for the wait, sir.

12:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

I'm glad you could join us.

I'll go to Mr. Jenner now, who has been on for a while, with his opening comments. Then we'll go back to Cape Town.

Mr. Jenner, please begin. You have five minutes.

October 26th, 2010 / 12:10 p.m.

Andrew Jenner Director, Intellectual Property and Trade, International Federation of Pharmaceutical Manufacturers and Associations

Thank you very much.

I hope you can hear me okay.

12:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

It's very good. Thank you.

12:10 p.m.

Director, Intellectual Property and Trade, International Federation of Pharmaceutical Manufacturers and Associations

Andrew Jenner

Thank you very much for allowing me to give evidence at this hearing. I represent the International Federation of Pharmaceutical Manufacturers and Associations, which is based in Geneva. We're a global not-for-profit NGO that represents the research-based industry. I am from the biotech and vaccine sectors. It has over 25 leading pharmaceutical companies and 46 national and regional associations from around the world.

I'll start my comments by really focusing on what we are trying to achieve with the access to medicines agenda, that is, certainly a sustainable access to quality and effective medicines. I think it's something you have heard, no doubt, before, but we really do need to have a useful picture of where this compulsory licensing provision, if you like, fits into the wider framework.

In order for us to achieve our shared goal, there are certain key components that need to be in place in order for us to get access to medicines. We know well about the importance of health care systems in countries. When I was working in government, I frequently worked on this area during the EU negotiations, and it was agreed to in the U.K.

A senior health official from Botswana made quite a stark comment by saying that you could drop all the medicines in the world in Botswana and it would make no difference to the situation there, because he realized the lack of infrastructure—and I know there are numerous comments that we could draw to there. As an example, the director of the WHO HIV division publicly said in 2006, and I quote:

Africa has been hardest hit by the AIDs epidemic…it is very obvious that the elephant in the room is not the current price of drugs. The real obstacle is the fragility of the health systems. You have health infrastructure that is dilapidated, and supply chains that don’t exist.

When we talk about access to medicines, we really do need to make sure we have effective health care systems and infrastructure in place, and health care officials are able to administer those medicines effectively and appropriately.

When we look at the actual medicines, this of course is a key part of the access puzzle. Some 95% of the medicines on the WHO essential medicines list are not covered by patents. That's not to say that the other 5% is not very important, but that really does put, if you like, this debate into context. We're talking about a small number of medicines. That could increase over time, of course.

What I'd like to do now is focus on the successes there have been over the last number of years that have not relied upon compulsory licensing provisions at all. The number of patients treated for HIV/AIDS went from 500,000 patients in 2003 to 1.57 million patients in January 2005. For example, the 3,140% increase between 2004 and 2006 was not achieved by any use of the compulsory licensing provisions.

Just to draw my thoughts to a conclusion, as the WTO director general has said, “Measure of success should not be the number of compulsory licences issued. But in our view it should be exactly what is happening on the ground in the access to medicines area.”

There's been a massive expansion of new initiatives for global funds, like the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, just to name one example. This increase in access to medicines does not rely upon compulsory licensing provisions. So we need to manage expectations that any amendment of a Canadian bill will not result in increased access to medicines.

But certainly, from a Geneva perspective, Canada manufactures high-quality generics, of course, but they are expensive. It is thought that for many of the countries in the Geneva context, the prime routes to get these patented medicines, which are necessary in generic form, you'd go to India or even China or other markets.

Certainly, when I was negotiating the EU regulation that implemented the same provisions across the EU, it was a well-known public fact that we thought at that time that the use of this provision would not be extensive, given the commercial considerations and the cost of medicines in Europe.

Thank you very much.

12:15 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

Thank you very much, Mr. Jenner.

We are now on to Ms. Paula Akugizibwe. I hope I got your name at least close. Thank you very much for investing your time. Please go ahead with your remarks, for five minutes.

12:15 p.m.

Advocacy Coordinator, AIDS and Rights Alliance for Southern Africa

Paula Akugizibwe

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to address the committee on this.

I work with the AIDS Rights Alliance for Southern Africa, which is a regional African organization of NGOs that are connecting people living with or affected by HIV. I'm not in a position to give you a detailed legal analysis of the proposed amendments, but I'm going to restrict my comments to three main points.

First is the affordability of medicine, one of the most critical influences of the political world...[Inaudible--Editor].

Secondly, the global HIV...[Inaudible—Editor]...in which decisions like this, which have major impacts, and this is the role of Canada in ensuring that developing countries have access to generic medicines from generic producers...[Inaudible--Editor]...is more important now than it has ever been in the past.

12:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

Ms. Akugizibwe, is there a way that you can move the microphone closer to you? Is it possible for you to have the microphone closer to you as you speak?

12:20 p.m.

Advocacy Coordinator, AIDS and Rights Alliance for Southern Africa

Paula Akugizibwe

I'm going to ask for some assistance. Can you hear me? Can I carry on in the meantime?

12:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

You can carry on, but it's pretty difficult to hear you.

12:20 p.m.

Advocacy Coordinator, AIDS and Rights Alliance for Southern Africa

Paula Akugizibwe

Is that better?

12:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

Much better.

12:20 p.m.

Advocacy Coordinator, AIDS and Rights Alliance for Southern Africa

Paula Akugizibwe

Okay.

I'm sure everyone is familiar with the fact that in 2007 Rwanda took a landmark step of notifying the WTO of its potential interest in importing a fixed dose combination of AZT, 3TC, and nevirapine from Apotex.

Beyond the global significance of being the first and in fact only country to benefit from this compulsory licensing possibility, the step carried a lot of significance in the national context, in that it was a necessary and unprecedented demonstration of the country's political commitment to the fight against HIV. It came at a time when Rwanda was transitioning to optimal treatment guidelines in keeping with the latest developments in international best practice; that is, moving away from D40-based regimens for HIV treatment to AZT-based regimens and shifting the threshold for initiation on ARV treatment from 200 to 315.

Rwanda was one of the first countries on the continent to adopt these guidelines and was therefore immediately faced with the significant cost implications that they entailed. At the time, best untried, best-priced ceilings—the shift from D40 to AZT—would entail a more than 30% increase in the cost of the drugs alone.

In 2007, although there were three Indian pharmaceutical companies manufacturing a combination of this nature that had been prequalified by the WHO, only one of these suppliers had agreed to charge low-price ceilings. So Apotex presented as the only competitive supplier for the tender.

Following the process, which was widely regarded as extremely cumbersome and quite prohibitive for future possibilities, the licence was ultimately granted, which allowed Apotex to successfully bid for the ARV tender at a competitive price, and that put Rwanda's efforts to accelerate treatment to the point at which it is now one of only two countries on the continent that have achieved better access to HIV treatment based on WHO guidelines.

I know that everyone is probably extensively familiar with this story, but I'm telling it to you again to emphasize the central point of my message today, which is that access to affordable ARVs often presents the critical catalyst or the critical inhibitor in realizing political ambitions to scale up universal access to HIV services.

James Orbinski, a Canadian academic, wrote in the Public Library of Science last year that for many in developing countries who live on less than $2 U.S. a day, access to health care technology is little more than a dream. Further, if a treatment is too expensive, other factors that can affect a medicine's availability, such as drug distribution systems and national drug use policies, become moot. It was only when generic competition lowered the price of antiretroviral therapy for HIV that the policy debate shifted from whether such therapy was possible in resource-poor settings to how to strengthen health infrastructure to provide comprehensive health care for people in such settings.

And I think this ties into the point that was made by the previous speaker about how a health care official in Botswana said that he could deliver all the best medicines in the world, but that without the infrastructure those medicines would mean nothing. I think that point is quite intuitive, just as the contrary to that point is intuitive, namely that you could have the best infrastructure, but without affordable medicines the infrastructure would not mean much.

I think the caution here is that we shouldn't get drawn into a whole dichotomy. Of course we need good health systems, but at the same time, without affordable medicines the country's ability to commit to scaling up systems to provide services—if it doesn't have the drugs that define the line between life and death—often greatly inhibits their political commitment to doing so.

When affordability is not certain, countries are forced to make compromises that can significantly affect the success of their programs. Recently, the chair of the South African national AIDS commission, introducing the country's new guidelines, stated that a tricky balance had to be struck between the top-range drug regimens, which are costly, versus some regimens that are cheaper but have more side effects. I think the point to realize here is that we're not only looking at how drug affordability affects a country's ability to scale up treatment, but also at decisions on what quality of treatment is scaled up from these countries.

For example, D40, which in many developed countries is not being used in treatment protocols anymore, is still being used in many sub-Saharan African countries simply because the cost of switching to AZT is prohibitive for many health systems. The spinoff of this is that many patients.... Recently a study in South Africa showed that within three years 21% of patients on D40 stopped taking the treatment because the toxicities are unbearable. But the more tolerable drugs, such as AZT, are less affordable, and therefore we are insisting on maintaining drugs that are not optimal.

It is similar to increasing treatment thresholds for initiation: whether someone is initiated at a CD4 of 200 or a CD4 of 315 is to a large degree affected by affordability of medicines.

Currently the global funding situation for HIV is looking quite dire. The recent replenishment of the global fund has left deep-seated anxiety in many people, because the amount that was pledged is barely going to be enough to sustain treatment programs, let alone to scale up.

Even before the global funding crisis for HIV that we witnessed over the past year, countries have begun to call the sustainability of treatment programs into question because of the cost of the medicines.

In Botswana, which for many years has been the poster child of the ARV rollout on the African continent, two years ago the president publicly stated that continued enrolment of new patients in treatment must be guaranteed beyond 2016, because it's possible treatment can be sustainable.

In this time of financial austerity, it's really crucial that we take every measure possible to reduce the cost associated with HIV programs, and one of the most critical opportunities to navigate this cost is in the area of drug procurement. Many countries are now looking to reduce the nine-drug cost associated with provision of ART. But while health systems can be changed through task-shifting and through decentralization to adapt to the changing economic context, the simple, concrete need for the drugs to keep people in these systems will not change, and it's just as critical as it was five years ago when this legislation was introduced. The only difference now, I guess, is that the role of Canada in the global generics field is even more crucial than it was in 2004.

Frankly, we're generating added competition that will even further drive down the prices of medication, something that is desperately needed given the funding crisis that I mentioned as well as the potential threat to accessing generics from Indian companies, which could possibly result from the free trade agreements that are currently being discussed between India and the EU.

12:25 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

Madam, I'm going to have to cut you off there. We're way over time. If you need to make some other points, try to do so during the question period. We'll continue with questions from other members now.

Mr. Malo, you have five minutes.

12:25 p.m.

Bloc

Luc Malo Bloc Verchères—Les Patriotes, QC

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank all our witnesses for joining us today.

My first question is for Ms. Akugizibwe, and perhaps also for Dr. Plummer, who mentioned his work in Nairobi during his presentation. He could perhaps answer me.

During our discussion with the previous panel of witnesses, we tried, with the help of a Doctors Without Borders representative, to understand why Apotex took so long to deliver the medicines. The reason given was that it was difficult to come to an agreement with a recipient country. The representative said that potential recipients were not quite sure how to use Canada's Access to Medicines Regime.

Is that your experience as well? Is that what you see in the field?

12:30 p.m.

Scientific Director General, National Microbiology Laboratory, Public Health Agency of Canada

Dr. Frank Plummer

Is that directed to me?

12:30 p.m.

Bloc

Luc Malo Bloc Verchères—Les Patriotes, QC

Yes, if you want to answer it.