Industry Committee on June 16th, 2016

[Victoria Lennox]

I see two opportunities in addition to the accessibility. The first one is that those who are creating things can now sell them on sites like Etsy. Old-school manufacturing and the creative industries now have a platform to reach customers.

On the other side of it, it's also changing the whole industry in that entrepreneurs are creating e-commerce companies and ordering their products from China. They never see their products. They are held by Amazon and the American market, and then they go out.

There are new business models that are forming, and that means that the talent being created might not be in the manufacturing sector but in sales, branding, design, and global platform development.

What we see with Yona Shtern and Beyond the Rack is the best of e-commerce. What we see with Ethan's group, Frank and—

[Avvey Peters]

The Frank and Oak entrepreneurs....

[Julia Deans]

Yes.

[Victoria Lennox]

With them, it's the best we see when it comes to manufacturing and e-commerce. It is a creating a level playing field, and entrepreneurs can more easily leverage global markets and opportunities from Amazon.

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Excellent.

Thank you.

Mr. Masse, take it home.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

With regard to entrepreneurs and those entering the market at a younger age, how much is the cost of education affecting their capabilities once they complete their education and carry a student debt? I have a number of businesses in my riding and have heard the comments about skills shortages. I know some skill shortages exist because people are graduating with degrees in fields where the technology or everything has moved on, or the debt-to-repayment ratio for a job in that field is not consistent with the recovery of that investment.

It's interesting, because over the years we've allowed training to be moved into the educational system and to be put on the backs of students, for the most part, and the general public, and then there's a complaint by business that students are not qualified. All of a sudden it's up to people who are going to university at the age of 17 and who are going to graduate with $30,000 to $40,000 worth of debt to understand and know what the market value of their degree is going to be four and a half years from now, and they have that debt burden. It seems like a pretty unfair thing to ask a 17- to 18-year-old.

I just put that out there. I see this happening in the workforce I speak of, including among tool and die makers, mould-making, and other things. Is it also affecting start-up entrepreneurs with a heavy debt load from tuition?

[Avvey Peters]

Two notions there are important. If I'm a start-up founder, every dollar I'm using to pay down a student loan is a dollar I'm not investing in my business. That certainly can be a barrier.

To the question of whether new grads are coming out of school with precisely the right skill set to go into existing companies, there's a mismatch in speed and pace. Industry is changing much more quickly than an academic curriculum can change. Bridging those two becomes really important. I'm biased, having done a University of Waterloo co-op degree myself, but it's one of those great mechanisms to help students not only to make money while they're studying and to keep their debt levels down, but also to get industry experience that is up to the minute. It gives them a significant advantage when they graduate.

[Julia Deans]

Labour market predictions are dodgy because they're always based on retrospective data, and that makes it really hard for young people. When it comes to student debt, it's an issue for everything they do, from starting a family to buying a house. It's a problem all around. In terms of our work, we recognize that student debt is part of the deal. We don't ever turn somebody away because they have student debt. But, for sure, it affects their ability to get on with launching a business.

[Victoria Lennox]

But at the same time, they can launch a business while they're in school as well. It's never been easier to start a business. Many government employees are running businesses on the side. It's possible to have income streams while you're studying. I was president of Oxford Entrepreneurs in the U.K., and I have a charity in the U.K. that works only with young entrepreneurs. We encourage students to start businesses while in school just in case the labour market isn't ready for them.

[A voice]

Yes, it's a good point.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

That is a good point, but I also represent many people who have part-time jobs because the family can't afford an apartment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Thank you very much. That's all the time we have for today.

I want to thank our guests for coming and doing a marvellous job. I loved your answers, loved your composure, and I think you guys are doing an amazing job.

We're going to break for—

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

It's the first all-female panel.

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Did I need to recognize that? Yes, I'd like to recognize that this is our first all-female panel.

We're going to break for two minutes, and then we'll come back and finish our housekeeping.

Thank you.

[Proceedings continue in camera]