Industry Committee on March 23rd, 2017

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

We're trying to develop good legislation all around the table here. One of the concerns I think the opposition parties and ourselves have is to make sure independence is maintained. That's part of my question about the advisory role, whereas the independence in decision-making still rests solely within your department.

[Anil Arora]

That is correct.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

That is reviewed by Governor in Council and by Parliament in what way?

[Anil Arora]

Let me parse that out.

First of all, the robust set of advisory committees we have currently provides technical advice on how best to go about measuring a phenomena, how things are evolving in the landscape of that particular aspect, and how we should go about responding to it. What are the data sources that are accessible to us that balance in respond and burden would cost with the kinds of outputs we get? They are technical committees, and they provide us with technical advice on how we would develop the instrument to go about measuring that gap.

As I said earlier, what the legislation does now, in fact, is fill a gap, because those advisory committees give advice to us internally, and it is very technical. There is no committee, no body that speaks to Canadians about how, overall, the system is evolving and where Statistics Canada is in that evolution journey, both domestically and internationally.

That's what that Canadian statistics advisory council will now do. It's mandate is to make the advice that's sought public, and to put out an annual report that speaks to the various dimensions, if you like, of quality, that consists in the national statistical—

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

We just finished a review—

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Thank you.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

I was going to go to C-25, but we won't go there.

Thanks.

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

We're going to move on to Mr. Nuttall.

Welcome back.

[Alex Nuttall, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you, Anil, for joining us today.

One of the questions or concerns that has been brought up with regard to the changes to the advisory committee is that when these changes take place there's always the background of partisanship in Ottawa. Picking up where Mr. Longfield left off, is there going to be any change in the system used to determine who will be on this advisory committee?

[Anil Arora]

The current National Statistics Council has had an interesting evolution in terms of how members were selected and made it onto the committee. There was a period of time when it was the minister, then it was the chief statistician making recommendations to the minister, and then it became the chief statistician essentially deciding who's on that council. What you've seen over time is an evolution of that.

Now we have 40 members on that council. We have gaps in terms of representation. In fact, five provinces and territories aren't represented on it. There's duplication in terms of content advice in an advisory committee, as well as from the National Statistics Council. The big thing is that in the evolution of the statistical systems, the independence that we're talking about here, there is a practice internationally on a body that can speak to the public at large. That's what this tries to do, provide that transparent mechanism for a body to be able to see where things are.

[Alex Nuttall, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

Right, but my question was specifically about whether there was a change in the way these people are chosen.

[Anil Arora]

Right.

That's what the legislation proposes, that it would be through the Governor in Council process, that they would go through the process as described in terms of the selection, the remuneration, and the representation they now would have to have, as with any other individual who serves in that capacity in many other bodies across the country.

[Alex Nuttall, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

Who is the individual, at the end of the day, who is responsible for these appointments?

[Anil Arora]

Again, it is a GIC process. I'm not the expert on that particular process, but there is an established process and we follow that.

[Alex Nuttall, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

Basically what you're saying is that previously the chief statistician would have been heavily involved in that process, and now it is the government itself. Is that correct?

[Anil Arora]

My understanding is that recommendations for people to serve in those capacities can come from various means.

[Alex Nuttall, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

Just to clarify, previously the recommendations were put forward by whom?

[Anil Arora]

As I said, in that evolution since 1985—

[Alex Nuttall, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

Okay, no more of this. They were previously put by the chief statistician. Is that correct?

[Anil Arora]

There was a period when they were appointed by the minister, there were also periods when the chief statistician recommended people, and there were points when the chief statistician actually nominated people.

[Alex Nuttall, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

One year ago, or two years ago, what happened? The chief statistician put forward the names. That's my understanding.

[Anil Arora]

My understanding is consistent with that.

[Alex Nuttall, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

Tomorrow, or the day after this is adopted, that will no longer be the case. Is that correct?

[Anil Arora]

That is correct.

There will be a formal, transparent process.

[Alex Nuttall, Conservative, Barrie—Springwater—Oro-Medonte, ON]

Leave the politspeak to the people who are in politics.

The process now will be a cabinet or a minister directly overseeing this and appointing people, so my concern is that we are actually getting away from an objective third party process. When I look at our bureaucracy, because I'm sure there are people of all parties working for the Canadian government, I hope that everybody leaves his or her personal feelings at the door when stepping into a job and really takes an objective approach to this. I'm not sure that can be said of politicians themselves, being one.

My concern is that this legislation, and you've confirmed this, is actually taking the objectivity away from this process. We're taking it out of the hands of the professionals and we're putting it into the hands of politicians.