Evidence of meeting #25 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was safety.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Director, Stakeholder and Industry Relations, Nav Canada
We've been hearing from our stakeholders that they have interest in hearing about findings before we submit them to Transport Canada. That's why we've proactively added that step.
NDP
Brian Masse NDP Windsor West, ON
Thank you for that.
How long do you think that will take? Are there times frames for people to make these submissions to you after that and for when that goes to the minister?
Director, Stakeholder and Industry Relations, Nav Canada
We anticipate having a comment period of about 60 days to allow people to make written representations. As well, once we've completed that phase, we'll have to assess the input before we submit it to Transport Canada, so that might take a few weeks from there as well.
NDP
Brian Masse NDP Windsor West, ON
That's why I hope the government just takes my bill and does it. I thank you for adding that, but that is another 60 days of uncertainty that the community, businesses and people have to live with. This is going to go on for a year or so in total. We started this in November, and you started preplanning before then. I hope the government just takes my bill and legislation through an order in council or passes it.
I think they're getting a lot of broad-range support from the NDP, the Bloc and the Conservatives on this. It seems like a lot of nonsense at a time when we have uncertainty. It's unnecessarily victimizing us and our airline industry for a few jobs and for qualified people who are good people.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sherry Romanado
Thank you, MP Masse.
Our next round of questions goes to MP Baldinelli.
You have the floor for five minutes.
Conservative
Tony Baldinelli Conservative Niagara Falls, ON
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you to the witnesses who are here today.
I just quickly want to follow up on some of the questions I've asked at previous meetings and so on. There seems to be a coalescing of an idea about the need for a sector-specific strategy for the aerospace industry.
I've asked previous witnesses about the need for the retention, the retraining and the recruitment of the workforce. A previous witness said that there is probably going to be a need for 55,000 employees in the sector by 2025. One witness mentioned a loss of about 33% of her workforce.
As we move into the future, I'd like to ask Mr. Whittaker, and then Mr. Bain or even Mr. Labbé about the needs.
Are there things we can do as a government to help the retention, retraining and recruitment for that skilled workforce you need?
Chief Executive Officer, AirShare Inc
Absolutely, there is stuff the government can do to both retain and retrain. The brain drain is something that has always been going on.
One of the things at this particular point in time that are perpetuating that are the programs that exist in other countries that could be redone. I think one of our witnesses talked this morning about continuity. These programs are particularly long term. They're very expensive and unique to this sector versus other sectors. Being able to have a program that allows employees to have certainty going forward in their companies, in their technologies and in the programs they participate in is really important.
Retraining and retention touch primarily on innovation and innovation support programs. We've heard multiple witnesses talk about the long term. Some of them are eight years long. The one we're in is five years long. Keeping an employee in uncertain times is difficult for a company to do on their own.
There is a silver lining. I think Christyn talked about this one. We're very thankful for defence procurement, because that's kept us alive. The commercial market completely disappeared on us, and we thank God for the defence sector because it kept us alive. Those things, leveraging those programs, will help us retain those employees.
On the retraining bit, I can't speak so much, but what I do know is that we're creating safety systems for autonomous vehicles that will ease somewhat the burden on air traffic controllers. It's not going to solve the issues that have been talked about this morning, but it should lessen the impact as we're now starting to introduce new things like drones into the airspace and have air traffic controllers deal with them as well as everything else.
I'll stop there, but those are two big themes that I would share with this committee on that question.
Conservative
Tony Baldinelli Conservative Niagara Falls, ON
Thank you.
Is there anything you would like to add, Mr. Bain or Mr. Labbé?
Chief Executive Officer and Co-Founder , NorthStar Earth and Space
Go ahead, sir.
Executive Chairman of the Board, Héroux-Devtek Inc.
I concur with my colleague who just spoke.
I think CADSI said it very clearly. If we can accelerate some of the defence programs, this will help to retain our workforce. Also, then, if we put the specific sectoral program in place, this is going to really help on the R and D side to keep our Ph.D.s, engineers and all our brain power to stay at work and then to also hire some.
Training could be part of it also. I think it would be a great idea, and I think accelerating defence procurement is a great idea, and creating the sectoral fund for aerospace is needed. If we want to keep our people, especially our brain power, that's what we need to do, in my opinion.
Chief Executive Officer and Co-Founder , NorthStar Earth and Space
Retention and retraining of people happens because there's a demand for your services or your products, and that comes from being competitive in the marketplace and that comes from from having clients who buy those services and products. I think Ms. Cianfarani made her point quite clearly that cheap stimulus means buying the services. Rick Whittaker referred to it in his reference to the U.S. government; they have a lot of programs they call OTA programs, “other transaction authorities”, whereby non-traditional defence companies can get access. We are actually pursuing one in the United States. NorthStar is pursuing an OTA transaction through a public-private partnership with the U.S. Space Force to deliver the types of services I talked about today. I don't have a similar mechanism here in Canada, and that's frustrating, because I'm competing with U.S. people who want to be able to do what NorthStar can do. We need to keep a sustainable advantage; you can't just innovate without selling the services.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sherry Romanado
Our next round of questions goes to MP Zann.
You have the floor for five minutes.
Liberal
Lenore Zann Liberal Cumberland—Colchester, NS
Thank you so much.
It's really great to hear all of you. What a very interesting topic this is. I want to say thank you so much for your work on behalf of Canadians.
I'd like to start with asking Mr. Best about the job of air traffic controllers. You had mentioned that it is one of the most stressful jobs in the world, and I have heard that as well. I've also heard that perhaps suicide rates within that industry are also concerning, especially in the United States, where they make, I believe, a whole lot less than they do in Canada, and it's a shame.
What percentage of your membership are women?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Air Traffic Control Association
The answer to the question I believe is currently about 19%.
Liberal
Lenore Zann Liberal Cumberland—Colchester, NS
So there are 19% women. Could you just let us know what your members are saying about the stress in this job, in this particular field?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Air Traffic Control Association
Yes, I can tell you a little bit about what we do. We're responsible for the safe, orderly, expeditious flow of air traffic. We're stationed in air control centres and control towers. We monitor aircraft position, speed and altitude in their assigned airspace, visually and by radar. We give directions to pilots by radio. The position of an air traffic controller is one that requires highly specialized knowledge, skills and abilities. We have to apply separation rules to keep aircraft at safe distance from each other and in their area of responsibility. We move all aircraft safely and efficiently through their assigned sector of airspace, as well as on the ground. We have a large responsibility while on duty, and we make countless real-time decisions on a daily basis. I think that this is the big one. We're constantly regarded around the world as being in one of the most mentally challenging careers, and it's one that has notoriously high stress.
Liberal
Lenore Zann Liberal Cumberland—Colchester, NS
Yes, because I would imagine they feel so much responsibility for lives. Thank you for that.
Earlier this month, a representative from the Aerospace Industries Association of Canada testified to this committee that the aerospace industry exists in a fierce, globally competitive marketplace, and because of this global competition, Canada would risk losing jobs and expertise to other countries in which the aerospace industry is recovering at a faster pace. I'd like to ask both Mr. Best and Mr. Bohn whether they share these concerns. How can the federal government help retain expertise and employment in this industry in the short and longer terms, particularly if, indeed, there are any layoffs planned?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Air Traffic Control Association
Thank you, Madam Chair, I'll step up first, ahead of Mr. Bohn.
We're very worried. We're very worried about the over 100 who have layoff or vulnerability letters right now. We already have several who are looking to work in Europe. Now the United States is also looking. Around the world, we're in high demand regularly, and it's mainly because of the skills we have. If I had the answer to what those skills were, I'd be a very wealthy person, but the fact of the matter is, not a lot have them. We're very worried that with what's happening right now, we're going to be losing more. It costs a lot to train an air traffic controller. It's anywhere from half a million to a million dollars to train depending on where you work and how long you have to train for. We're certainly worried.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Nav Canada
You asked the question about support as well. From our perspective, establishing targets for opening travel—with the appropriate science-backed safeguards, obviously, such as rapid testing and appropriate isolation time frames—would mitigate risk and could make a big difference.
As well, it would be our view, as mentioned earlier, that government assistance would also have a significant positive impact on the system and on jobs going forward.
Industry engagement through channels such as the government's aviation restart working group is certainly something we've been involved in discussions on and will continue to want to have impact upon as we reshape the recovery.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sherry Romanado
We'll now start our third round of questions.
Our first round of questions goes to MP Poilievre. You have the floor for five minutes.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Carleton, ON
Thank you, Madam Chair.
I would like to direct my questions to my constituent, Rick Whittaker, from Riverside South in the south end of Ottawa.
Rick, when you walked into my office with a missile, I have to say I was rather concerned. You laid that missile down on the desk and you told me that it was entirely for peaceful purposes. It took some explaining.
For those who are not familiar with your technology, let me just summarize it as I understand it. You can correct me wherever I get anything wrong.
Right now we have the problem of drones that try to spy over top of miliary bases or swoop in on outdoor concerts and gather up all of the music and entertainment so that they can beam it copyright-free onto the Internet and profit from it.
As I understand it, your technology, which you developed in your basement in Riverside South, takes a 3D-printed missile that shoots up into the air and, when it's in the vicinity of the drone, explodes a series of latex yoga bands that ensnare the propellers of the drone. Those elastic bands are attached to a parachute, which causes the drone to come gently down to earth to where engineers can recover it, erase any sensitive information from being transmitted to the wrongdoer who put it in the sky in the first place, and do so without harming anyone. You've described this as the world's friendliest drone missile.
Did I get that right?