Industry Committee on Nov. 30th, 2023

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Just so we can't—

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Alexandre Plourde]

As a consumer association, we don't deal with those kinds of issues. I just want to mention, however, that political parties are covered by the bill in Quebec.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

Mr. Gambs or Mr. Mellouli, if you want to weigh in, the floor is yours.

[Sébastien Gambs]

For me, I think it should also include political parties. Anyone who has to collect personal data should also be included in law. I mean, I come from France, where political parties are also subject to the privacy legislation, so I don't know why it should be different here. It's still sensitive and personal data, so the obligation should be the same for political parties.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

You're still going to get taxed the same, despite your position.

Do I have enough time—

[Sehl Mellouli]

[Inaudible—Editor]

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Oh, I'm sorry.

[Sehl Mellouli]

I agree with Mr. Gambs. I think political parties should be covered.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Great. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

Thank you, Mr. Massé.

Mr. Vis, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Ms. Levac, on October 3, Minister Champagne sent a letter to the committee indicating that the government is considering an amendment to the preamble of the bill and to section 12 of the Consumer Privacy Protection Act to enhance the protection of children's personal information.

In the brief you submitted to the committee, you state that the amendments proposed by Minister Champagne are not sufficient to adequately protect children's personal information. Today, in your testimony, you mentioned that we should make an amendment to the bill to protect the best interests of the child.

What other measures can we adopt to improve this bill in order to protect our children?

[Sara Eve Levac]

First, the proposed amendment to section 12 talks about the sensitivity of personal information that is collected, used or disclosed. There are other stages in the life of personal information where the best interests of the child should be taken into account, such as access to, retention of, or destruction of that information.

For us, the best interests of the child are part of a more global vision that makes it possible to take into account considerations other than the sensitivity of a piece of information, by asking questions about what is conducive to respecting all the rights of the child and its development.

In addition to the amendments that would incorporate the best interests of the child, we are also proposing an amendment to the French version of subclause 4(a). In the English version, it is clear that the child has the right to exercise their own recourse, but in French, it is less clear.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Thank you.

I recently read about VTech and children's toys. Could we make an amendment to the bill to protect children when it comes to Internet-connected toys, among other things?

[Sara Eve Levac]

An amendment that takes into account the best interests of the child would force us to consider the best interests of the child in all stages of the design of a new toy, from its design to its marketing, and in all subsequent decisions related to a child's personal information.

Another way to protect children in relation to smart toys is the concept of privacy by design, which requires that privacy risks be considered in the design of a new service or good and throughout the process.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Thank you very much.

In the brief you submitted to the committee, you state that the measures proposed in clause 55 of the bill enabling consumers to request the removal of their personal information are incomplete. You deplore the fact that the bill does not contain some iteration of a right to be forgotten, as is the case in Europe and Quebec.

What do you think are the shortcomings of clause 55?

[Alexandre Plourde]

Thank you very much for asking that question in French.

I have two things to say about clause 55.

First of all, as you mentioned, it provides for a right to delete, but with a caveat: If the company has stated in its policy that it can keep personal information, it will keep it. It gives a very broad way out for companies. A framework should be provided for this right to ensure that consumers are protected.

It's very important to be able to delete your personal information. In Quebec, there was the computer security breach at Desjardins, a financial institution that retained the personal information of its clients for a very long time. The ability to delete your personal information avoids harm and prevents identity theft.

However, the right to deletion provided for in the bill is not a right to be forgotten. In the digital environment, there is plenty of information about us that can be propelled into the public sphere, end up on corporate servers and remain there forever. The Internet never forgets. Even if the information is published legally, it can cause harm to consumers who are not affected by the right to disposal provided for in the bill.

For example, imagine that I am someone who committed a minor crime several years or several decades ago. If that pops up every time you Google my name, it can affect my job prospects, my reputation and my ability to rebuild my life. It's the same thing—

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

It could even be a child who has done something stupid.

[Alexandre Plourde]

Yes, that's an even better example. When a child makes a blunder or someone else posts photos or videos involving them, all of that stays online indefinitely, and when you Google their name, it pops up. This can damage a person's reputation, cause them to be bullied, and even constitute material to commit identity theft.

Legislative solutions have been put in place. Europe has adopted the right to be forgotten, as we have done in Quebec. It's also called the right to de-indexing. It enables a person to go to Google or any other digital platform and ask them to remove certain personal information if they are being negatively affected.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Has the Quebec bill ever been used? Do you have an example?

[Alexandre Plourde]

It's hot off the press; it just came into force a month or two ago, so I'm not aware of any enforcement cases.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Okay.

If you find any, please let us know.

[Alexandre Plourde]

I'd be happy to.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

Thank you, Mr. Vis. I'm always happy to give you more time when you make the effort to speak in French. Congratulations, by the way. Your efforts have been noticed and are noteworthy.

Mr. Sorbara, you have the floor.