Subcommittee on International Human Rights Committee on March 26th, 2015

[Francis Scarpaleggia, Liberal, Lac-Saint-Louis, QC]

Okay, and it's just gripped the country.

[Dr. Anuradha Bose]

It's gripped the country from the day General Ziaur died.

[Francis Scarpaleggia, Liberal, Lac-Saint-Louis, QC]

Interesting.

I probably have a bit of time. Perhaps Ms. Grewal would like to take the time—whatever the rules of this committee are.

[The Chair, Conservative, Scott Reid]

Thank you very much. That's very generous of you.

Actually we'll go to Mr. Wilks, who is the next speaker, and then if he has some time left over we'll transfer that to Ms. Grewal, and then we'll go on as we always do to Mr. Benskin.

[David Wilks, Conservative, Kootenay—Columbia, BC]

Thank you, Chair. I will share my time with Ms. Grewal.

Thank you very much for the informative discussion today. I'm not a member of this committee. Mr. Hillier is, but he's away today.

I do want you to maybe just explain a little more for me with regard to the Awami League. You said that the minority lean toward that party even though they are subject to harassment and threats. Could you explain to me and break down for me the Awami League—what it consists of, and why the minority go to it even under threat of violence?

[Dr. Anuradha Bose]

The Awami League is the founding party of Bangladesh. It was the party of Sheikh Mujibur Rahman, who was the father of Sheikh Hasina.

Bengalis, whether they are from West Bengal or from Bangladesh, are hellishly sentimental. They hold a very soft corner in their hearts for the founder's party, and he did try to make it into a secular country. He put it into the constitution and people will remember that, especially in the older generation. The younger generation says that it's six of one, half a dozen of the other. They're very cynical. The older people will still lean towards it and they will do it. If they can get to the votes, they will.

This is a strange phenomenon in South Asia. The middle and upper classes didn't used to vote. It's the poor who voted and they like the idea of voting, just as some of them also like the idea of ballot stuffing because they are paid to do it. But people do discuss politics and they do like to vote. It's a strange idea, but they do.

[David Wilks, Conservative, Kootenay—Columbia, BC]

Why is it that the middle to upper classes are not, for lack of a better word, interested in voting? I understand why the poor would because they have a lot to gain by an opportunity to use their voice, but the middle to upper classes would have a lot to lose as well.

[Dr. Anuradha Bose]

You will forgive me, parliamentarians, for being a trifle cynical here. In Bangladesh you can get what you want. There are other ways of influencing politicians other than through the parliamentary process, so why should they bother putting somebody there who they can easily reach in many other ways, some of which are not very savoury?

My mother was an Indian politician, and I have some idea.

[David Wilks, Conservative, Kootenay—Columbia, BC]

Thank you very much.

I'll share the rest of my time with Ms. Grewal.

[The Chair, Conservative, Scott Reid]

Ms. Grewal, you have three minutes if you want to use it.

[Nina Grewal, Conservative, Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC]

Mr. Sweet has something.

[The Chair, Conservative, Scott Reid]

Mr. Sweet? That works, too.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Ms. Bose, thank you for your testimony.

Have you been on the ground yourself in Bangladesh in the recent past?

[Dr. Anuradha Bose]

Not in the recent past, but when I taught at Birmingham I taught a lot of senior civil servants from Bangladesh, what they called permanent secretaries, who are at the DM level.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Do you have many sources in Bangladesh to keep you informed?

[Dr. Anuradha Bose]

Yes, because Mr. Sinha Roy, and the founders of this particular chapter, all have family there and they keep in touch. I am a news junkie and since I learned to read in Bengali, I'm even more of one. I didn't used to know.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

We've had a lot of discussion about many things, but no one to my knowledge or recollection has brought up the influence of surrounding countries—China, Burma, etc. What roles are these other countries playing? There has to be some kind of interest for them in Bangladesh's situation being unstable right now.

[Dr. Anuradha Bose]

I know that India is not best pleased; they never have been. We should also remember that during the 1971 war many of the Awami League took refuge in India and then India came to Bangladesh's aid, so the ties there are fairly strong. As you know, India has a very porous border with Bangladesh. People have fields through which the border runs. There is a lot of smuggling there. India has always looked very warily at Bangladesh.

What surprises me even more is the influence of Pakistan, which is practically one continent away. With the advent of the military dictators, who were trained in military colleges in Pakistan, the influence came back. In the first few years there was a great chill between these countries, and rightly so. If you read Gary Bass's book, The Blood Telegram, you will see the enmity that existed and in some areas still exists, which is why the bloggers were able to bring all those people out onto the streets calling for the death penalty for any of the war criminals from 1971.

About China, it is hard to say; I have not much idea. But since I have been a student of the politics of Pakistan and Afghanistan, I can see where the links would come, especially with Pakistan.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Are the religious minorities suffering from a lot of human trafficking as well?

[Dr. Anuradha Bose]

I wouldn't know, but definitely there is some among the hill tribes and the plains tribes. This is something our Catholic counterparts would know about. From the hill tribes, yes, definitely—

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Is it primarily for labour?

[Dr. Anuradha Bose]

No... or yes, it's for labour, if you call sex work labour.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

So it is for sex work as well.

[Dr. Anuradha Bose]

Yes, and it's because hill tribe women are considered very pretty—that's the stereotype—and also the most needy.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.