Subcommittee on International Human Rights Committee on Nov. 19th, 2020

[Roy Gombiro]

Before I hand it over to Ms. Gadza, I will say that to begin with, as a community there are not a lot of us, because the immigration policies haven't always supported bringing Zimbabweans, or at least as many Zimbabweans as we would like, partly because of the geography. We're some 28 hours away by flight from Zimbabwe. Just to get a ticket to come to Canada is quite pricey on the local community, as well as just organizing visas.

The second thing is that when we come to Canada, we're trying to establish ourselves. It's a very different culture and a very different way of living, which is supposed to be the way that it is because of different backgrounds. With that said, we've found that Canada has become a home, especially for some of us who are quite fortunate to have made it all the way from Zimbabwe.

With that I'll pass it on to Ms. Gadza.

[Tsitsi Gadza]

Thank you, Mr. Gombiro.

Honourable member, my interpretation is not working, so I didn't quite understand the question.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

So I will go immediately to my second question, since time is running out.

My question is for Ms. Kujeke.

Your testimony is quite striking. We are sad to hear about the reality facing your compatriots. I would like you to tell me how food insecurity various from one segment of the population to another. How do women and girls, and Zimbabweans in general, receive international assistance?

Does the assistance reach the people who are suffering so much?

Why do the segments exist, and why are women and girls more affected?

[Makanaka Kujeke]

Thank you, honourable member.

We believe that women and children are facing the brunt of many of the crises in Zimbabwe, especially children, given how reliant....

My apologies. May I continue, honourable member?

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Yes, please.

[Makanaka Kujeke]

Given how reliant children are on the health care system, when hospitals are closed or only deemed good for the elite, with high costs for children needing assistance or for women who need assistance to deliver their children, it means that they face the brunt of a lot of the crises that are occurring. Also, any single-parent mothers may be unable to find employment because of the high unemployment rate. They might be in rural communities where they are forced to make good with whatever resources they're given, whether that is having to renounce any political affiliations or having to use a bucket of sewage water to keep their children clean and reuse it to cook their meals and to maintain their household.

We feel that if the Canadian government partnered with UNWFP to expand the program that currently assists those 20 regions and those 550,000 Zimbabweans we mentioned, it would take a large burden off these women and children, who might be in single-parent homes or dual-parent homes, and it would allow them to focus on meeting other basic needs they might have.

Another topic that we weren't able to touch on, unfortunately, was electricity. About 40% of all Zimbabwe communities receives electricity; another 60% doesn't receive any electricity at all. The 40% that do receive it are subjected to 18 hours a day of load shedding, and when electricity does return to these homes, children and families must rise and make their meals for the day and children must complete any schoolwork they have. This is usually at 3 or 4 a.m., and only for about an hour. Zimbabwe is part of the Southern African Power Pool, and we feel if the Canadian government were to condemn Zimbabwe for not meeting the objectives of the Southern African Power Pool—which does include sustainable development, providing reliable and efficient electricity and providing electricity to those rural communities—just that condemnation would be enough, or would start something great. Zimbabwe would feel that the international community was keeping an eye on the goings-on of the nation to ensure all civilians were receiving the basic necessities.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

Thank you, Ms. Kujeke.

We're moving to the NDP. Monsieur Boulerice will be our last questioner for this panel.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I'd first like to thank the three witnesses at the meeting this evening.

I thank you for making time to meet with us. I also thank you for all the work you are doing.

I completely understand that unemployment, poverty and misery lead to revolt. Demonstrations against hunger are taking place and demonstrators are being repressed by the police. So police brutality, beatings and injuries are happening. The police brutality aside, I'd like to know the extent of the human rights violations we're talking about here.

Are there arbitrary detentions, prolonged detentions without charges, or cases of torture?

How does the justice system in general work? Again, are there any significant problems there as well?

I imagine that issues do exist, but I'd like to hear about it from either of you. I think that would be useful.

[Makanaka Kujeke]

Thank you, honourable member.

There have been human rights violations, such as— [Technical difficulty—Editor]

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

I think the audio froze.

[Roy Gombiro]

Maybe I'll take that question.

Honourable member, thank you for your question and thank you for having us.

There have been a lot of human rights violations, including torture. Obviously we're not present in some of these situations. You only have to see the pictures, some of which we've shared with you, of the nature and extremity of the violations.

We have people being abducted. We have people being incarcerated for no particular reason. Sometimes it's political, but isn't it the very nature of freedom and freedom of speech to be able to express yourself without being put under undue pressure?

This is what every Zimbabwean faces, especially the local community, the local people, with the exception of the elite, because they are the ones calling the shots and imposing all this harshness on the people of Zimbabwe.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Thank you very much.

You suggested that the Canadian government invest to help the people of Zimbabwe by humanitarian and economic means, and that it do so directly through NGOs rather than through the government, which seems fraught with problems and corruption.

Do you feel Zimbabwe has humanitarian or community groups sufficiently independent of the government to make such an approach truly effective and useful on the ground?

[Roy Gombiro]

Unfortunately, that is not quite the case. Again, as much as they might be independent and might respond back to the Canadian government, they are still in Zimbabwe; they are still in the territory of Zimbabwe.

As much as we can try, as much as we can have the Canadian government do so, I think it would require almost lateral conversations with the Canadian government and the Zimbabwean government, in addition to humanitarian organizations being on the ground and assisting in the acute need for water, the acute need for food and the acute need for shelter, in order to assist in that.

With that, I'll pass it on to witness Tsitsi Gadza to elaborate more. This is not a one-solution type of issue. We need to approach it in a multi-dimensional way.

[Tsitsi Gadza]

Thank you, honourable member.

I would just reinforce that Zimbabwe is not a country that is reliant on donations or distributions. Zimbabwe is made up of hard-working people. However, it turns out that due to the environmental changes, climate change and the economic environment, as well as the poverty in the country, the conditions for people have gotten to the extent that they have. Also, the poor administration, the government administration there that is corrupt, has led people not to be able to live comfortably, be able to live within their means, to the extent that a lot of people have had to leave the country. There's a lot of brain drain as a result. It's not because they don't want to be in Zimbabwe.

I, for one, would go back home if the situation got better, but because of the economic conditions, I have to fend for myself and I have to fend for my family. I still have family back home. My heart bleeds. It's heart-wrenching just to see the conditions of poverty and the deteriorating health systems in Zimbabwe.

That's why we are coming before the Canadian government, before this committee: to find out if there's any help we can get to alleviate and improve the way of life for the people in Zimbabwe.

I apologize. My French translation is not working properly. I've been working with IT to get this resolved. I might not have answered the question fully, but this is the best I could do, based on the hand-off that I got from Mr. Gombiro.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Thank you, Ms. Gadza.

I don't believe I have enough time to ask another question. That being the case, would another witness like to use the remaining 30 seconds to add something?

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

That will conclude this panel.

I want to thank the witnesses for coming forward and informing us on the current situation in Zimbabwe and what is happening there. You did amazingly well, even with all the hiccups we had with the technology. It was terrific. We will see what we can do as a committee to see if our analysts can prepare a statement for your group and the situation taking place in Zimbabwe.

Members, we will be going in camera, so we will be suspending at this time.

[Proceedings continue in camera]