Evidence of meeting #20 for International Trade in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was clause.
A recording is available from Parliament.
9 p.m.
Liberal
Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS
I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.
I draw attention to and can provide a copy to the honourable member of the agreement signed between Colombia and Canada. In fact it requires the Canadian government to do a report on--
9 p.m.
Liberal
Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS
No, but it's a point of truth, which the honourable member ought to acquaint himself with periodically.
9 p.m.
Voices
Oh, oh!
9 p.m.
An hon. member
We have to be accurate.
9 p.m.
Conservative
The Acting Chair Conservative Larry Miller
I think it is a point of order, because it corrects something that's on the record. Thank you, Mr. Brison.
Mr. Julian.
9 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Of course, as Mr. Brison knows, if he really wanted to hear from human rights organizations or labour organizations, he would have allowed them to come before the committee.
The evidence was pretty preponderant that folks were giving a thumbs down to this idea that the Colombian government report on itself. That is why, Mr. Chair, we're now in the state we are in, in which the Speaker is going to have to rule to what extent—
9:05 p.m.
Liberal
Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS
If in fact human rights organizations believed my colleague that in fact this agreement was one that only required Colombia to report on themselves, I wouldn't blame them for making the wrong conclusion, because they were being provided with the wrong information. If they in fact read the agreement, which I suspect some of them will in time, they will probably see the merit of it.
But again, if they were to base their decision concerning the merit of the agreement on the information, or rather misinformation,of Mr. Julian, then I wouldn't blame them for drawing the wrong conclusion.
June 1st, 2010 / 9:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Acting Chair Conservative Larry Miller
That may not have been a point of order, but it was a great clarification. Thank you, Mr. Brison.
Mr. Julian.
9:05 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Actually, as Mr. Brison knows, letters are starting to come in, because finally, after many weeks and many people asking him, there is information out there. It will be interesting to see, as certainly the e-mails I've been getting even this evening have indicated that people have read the agreement and realize that it does exactly as many people feared: it allows the Colombian government to report on itself. People don't find that particularly strong, given the depth and breadth of the human rights violations that are ongoing in Colombia, Mr. Chair.
That's the point. That's why I'm offering this amendment, among many amendments that hopefully we'll be considering over the course of the next few hours, Mr. Chair.
In a committee hearing that is responsible and does its due diligence, it would take many, many hours to go through this agreement and provide the kinds of amendments and adjustments that would ease the many, many concerns that have been raised across the country, Mr. Chair.
I've been to many public meetings. They've always been full. With very few exceptions, people who have raised concerns about Colombia have been 98% or 99% of the people present at these meetings. I have not seen any similar meetings of the public at which the public has said they feel the Colombian government's reporting on itself is an appropriate way of dealing with the human rights violations.
Be that as it may, Mr. Chair, providing a sustainable human development is—
9:05 p.m.
Liberal
Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS
Mr. Chair, again I draw the honourable member to the binding agreement, the treaty between Canada and Colombia, which in fact requires Canada to report on human rights in Colombia and the impact of the FTA, and also the Colombian government, and of course on Canada as well.
The honourable member is either obtuse or dishonest, and I will assume it's the former, because he is an honourable member. I am certainly trying to be constructive and help him understand this. It's in plain black and white and signed in English, French, and Spanish. I would urge him to read that agreement, because I'm certain he wouldn't intentionally disseminate information that he knows is false.
9:05 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
That's not a point of order, Mr. Chair, and I was actually completing my comments on the amendment, but Mr. Brison's intervention has, of course, made me react by citing what was in the document that was tabled in the House. I'll read it very clearly, Mr. Chair, so that it's there for the record: “The Agreement concerning Annual Reports on Human Rights and Free Trade will not require additional resources.” It “will not require additional resources”, Mr. Chair. If that's not vacuous—saying that what we get is rubber-stamping of a report produced by the Colombian government—I don't know what is.
But as I say, Mr. Chair, I think the public, now that it finally has a copy of it, will be weighing in on this. It has been withheld for far too long and only brought out as closure was being pushed upon the committee—I think understandably, because Mr. Brison knows full well that witnesses coming before this committee would have ripped this cheap and tawdry amendment to shreds.
9:10 p.m.
Liberal
Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS
Mr. Chair, I've been called cheap and tawdry by better people than the honourable member.
9:10 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
That's unparliamentary.
With that, Mr. Chair, I will move my amendment.
9:10 p.m.
Conservative
The Acting Chair Conservative Larry Miller
Okay, and it's such a good one, I'd like to call the vote on it.
9:10 p.m.
Voices
Oh, oh!
9:10 p.m.
NDP
9:10 p.m.
Conservative
The Acting Chair Conservative Larry Miller
Okay. There's a first for everything.
Madam Clerk.
(Amendment negatived: nays 6; yeas 2)
9:10 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
Yes.
So we go back to page 2, Mr. Chair, line 36. It would read “the harmonious and sustainable development of” as opposed to “harmonious development of economic relations between Canada and the Republic of Colombia”.
Mr. Chair, I'll speak very briefly to this. Of course, the issue around environmental devastation in parts of Colombia is something that came up in the aborted hearings this committee started to have prior to closure and to what we've gone through today, which of course will be decided in another place, Mr. Chair.
Most Canadians believe in sustainable development, and I think adding that to the purpose of the agreement would help in some small way to address the egregious problems that have been identified with the agreement.
9:10 p.m.
Conservative
The Acting Chair Conservative Larry Miller
Okay. Is there discussion on the amendment.
All in favour of amendment NDP-1—