International Trade Committee on Sept. 26th, 2016

[Gerry Ritz, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

Thank you, ladies and gentlemen, for your presentations today. They have been very informative. I loved hearing from you.

Mr. Johnston, I was intrigued with the size and scope of what you've developed in starting out as a small player and then growing to the size you are now. We hear a lot of discussion about jobs that potentially will be lost if we do this, but you're an example of jobs that are created when you expand your trade footprint, and that's good news.

I'm looking at page 5 of your deck. As we look at the tariff rates in some of the TPP countries, it's going to make a huge difference to you to level that playing field. You don't have the U.S. statistics on that page. Was there a reason they were left out?

[Peter Johnston]

There are no trade tariffs between the U.S. and Canada.

[Gerry Ritz, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

No, it's flat.

[Peter Johnston]

It's flat, exactly. This would look the same for the U.S.

[Gerry Ritz, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

You didn't show that but....

Peru is an interesting.... I was down there and I think there are 3,000 varieties of potatoes grown. They have 28 different ecoclimates. Then they have the seed bank, of which Ag Canada funds a portion. They have tens of thousands of different seed varieties.

The really interesting potato is one that is all knobby and bumpy. It's called the mother-in-law potato. If you go to your girlfriend's house and the potential mother-in-law peels the potato very accurately and nicely, it means she likes you. If she just hacks it all up, she doesn't. That's the potato industry in Peru.

You show the differences in the market from 2014 to 2015. Your increase in Japan and Singapore was phenomenal. Those are valuable markets. On the dollar numbers you still did well. It was the access you lost in Malaysia, Australia, New Zealand, and so on, which weren't big markets to begin with, but it's the value of these markets, not the volume.

[Peter Johnston]

It's the value of these markets. Getting your foot in the door, if you will, should develop further opportunities. These are growing markets. The Asia-Pacific is the growing region for our market and our products.

[Gerry Ritz, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

How much do you spend as a company on research and development to analyze market by market, and sell what they want, not what we have?

[Peter Johnston]

Without giving a dollar value, a significant amount. We have a significant amount of effort and energy in our market insights, not only in Canada and the U.S., but globally.

[Gerry Ritz, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

It's an amazing story, and I thank you for it.

Mr. Sprague, as a lawyer, in your presentation, you talked about there's not a legal definition of “public purpose” and you would like to see it defined. Is there not a historical definition in Canada that would supersede? Or are you saying that just goes to zero and we start over?

[Leigh Sprague]

I believe there is some case law from arbitration boards and other trade agreements, jurisprudence that uses either “public purpose” or similar phrasing. Again, it's about control. We'd be ceding the growth of the meaning of the term “public purpose”; we'd be giving that up.

[Gerry Ritz, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

Have you done an analysis of public purpose in the other TPP countries compared to Canada? How much difference is there and where would we see an attack coming from, if I can say it that way?

[Leigh Sprague]

No, it's not the other countries' interpretations that we'd be concerned about.

[Gerry Ritz, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

But they're the ones who would have to...because it's only within the TPP bloc of countries, those 11 other countries. I was wondering if you had red-flagged someone, as in Japan is going to be the big offender, or the U.S., or something like that.

[Leigh Sprague]

No, not in that sense.

[Gerry Ritz, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

Ms. Smith, welcome to Canada. With eight and a half years, you're well versed. Welcome here.

You talk about 1,300 members in long-term care. Of course that's a growth industry across Canada when we look at the baby boomers and the bubble that's pushing, and I'll be getting there very soon myself.

You talk about trade deals that should lift all labour standards. I agree with you wholeheartedly. That's why there's a chapter in the TPP on labour standards that says anyone coming to Canada with any kind of export or expertise or whatever, has to meet those Canadian standards.

Is that not good enough? How do we make that even more Canada-friendly?

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

If you can make it a short answer, it'd be appreciated.

[Jessica Smith]

Yes, not a problem.

Under the chapter, and I'm not sure, are you talking about chapter 12 or the other chapter that specifically talks about the labour language?

[Gerry Ritz, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

The labour chapter.

[Jessica Smith]

Yes. The labour chapter specifically has very vague language and there's no way to truly enforce it. It talks very much—

[Gerry Ritz, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

Lawyers tend to like vague so they can kind of move it this way and that way.

[Jessica Smith]

You do to a point, but if there's no enforceable way to enforce it when it talks about that they'll endeavour or that countries will consult with each other to make sure something happens. There's no system in place to actually ensure it's going to happen.

That's the issue with that. There's no guarantee it's going to happen, because there's nothing in place saying it has to happen: we'll consult with other countries on these issues, or we'll endeavour to make sure these things will happen. There are no set, enforceable rules.

[Gerry Ritz, Conservative, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

The language isn't strong enough.

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

Thank you. We're going to move to the Liberals now with MP Ludwig, our hostess in New Brunswick.

You have five minutes.

[Karen Ludwig, Liberal, New Brunswick Southwest, NB]

Thank you all for your informative presentations. Leigh, it's nice to see you again after all these years from the early days of New Brunswick Community College.

I have a number of questions.

Ms. Smith, regarding the temporary foreign workers program, I want to reassure you that our government is reviewing that entire program. A report should be coming out later on this year. It's before the standing committee.

We face an interesting situation in New Brunswick where there are concerns regarding temporary foreign workers and abuses. The cases I've heard locally are quite different, and less so than in other parts of the country, but we also face a labour shortage. As a federal government, we're working toward what's called the Atlantic growth strategy. Over the next 16 months, we are looking to promote immigration that is employer-driven by 2,000. Looking at the chapter within the TPP under labour mobility, is it not specifically directed to highly skilled labour requirements that are locally needed?

[Jessica Smith]

I'm sorry, what's the question?