International Trade Committee on Oct. 18th, 2016

[Tracey Ramsey, NDP, Essex, ON]

Vikki, what would be the impact of increased drug costs in Yukon on the people you represent?

[Vikki Quocksister]

Yukon is different, because the government pays for a lot of our medication. The unions always have fairly good drug plans. I'm not sure it's really going to affect the workers within unions as much as it would those who don't have a workplace drug plan.

[Tracey Ramsey, NDP, Essex, ON]

Maybe we'll go back to your concerns about labour mobility for the workers you represent.

I'm curious as to what the job market looks like there. What is the potential for people to find work, first of all, in Yukon, and how would opening up the labour mobility chapter, which has been called the temporary foreign worker program on steroids by those who have presented here, affect those you represent and workers across Yukon?

[Vikki Quocksister]

That's a huge issue. I know that the chamber and I won't agree on this aspect, and that's all right.

The temporary foreign worker program and the nominee program have brought in a lot of foreign workers. The problem with that is, obviously, they get sent home sometimes when the programs don't work out.

It also takes jobs away from Yukoners. The first nations here are very concerned about these programs. They want to see more training for their members. They feel that the temporary foreign worker program takes away from their ability to get jobs. If this is in a trade agreement, I'm not sure how the government is going to ensure that the first nations are going to be first to have positions that pay well.

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

You only have a half a minute.

[Tracey Ramsey, NDP, Essex, ON]

Can you speak to the impact of climate change in the north and the fact that this has not been included in this agreement?

[Vikki Quocksister]

I delivered mail in the 1990s. I used to do it in temperatures that were at -50° for a month. We haven't seen -40° in years, and if that's not proof of climate change, I don't know what is.

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

Thank you.

We're going to move over to the Liberals. Mr. Peterson, you have five minutes. Go ahead.

[Kyle Peterson, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, everyone, for contributing to this and providing us with your insight into the trans-Pacific partnership. It is appreciated by those of us on the committee.

Mr. Marshall, you characterized an infrastructure deficit. What types of infrastructure are we talking about? Here in the south we might have a different idea of what infrastructure means. What are the gaps and what are the needs? What would this infrastructure look like if we were able to build it?

[Brendan Marshall]

The general principle with infrastructure in the territories is that the deficit increases as you move east. Even though Yukon, relatively speaking, is the most built environment in the territories, it's still at a significant deficit compared to southern jurisdictions. As you move farther east, to give an example, in Nunavut mining companies have built the largest and longest roads in the territory at 100% private expense.

In terms of the type of infrastructure that can facilitate an increase in project competitiveness as well as viability for certain types of projects, we're speaking about trade-enabling infrastructure—roads, ports, airstrips, railways. The reality is that the type of infrastructure is highly contingent on the nature of the project itself, but as a general standpoint, that's the type of infrastructure we would like to see built.

To build off some of the previous questioning in respect to climate change, we would also like to see a viable opportunity for heavy industry in the north, as well as residents in the north, to switch away from diesel. Right now the power infrastructure in the north is insufficient to the extent that the opportunity simply does not exist.

[Kyle Peterson, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Thank you for that.

You mentioned the Alaskan model, and I think you referred to it as AIDEA. What is that acronym?

[Brendan Marshall]

AIDEA is the Alaska Investment and Development Export Authority.

[Kyle Peterson, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Is that funded in part by private corporations in partnership with government?

[Brendan Marshall]

No, it was a single capital allocation from the state government, and it was capitalized in 1988, I believe. The institution predates that, but it had a remodelling in 1988 and it was capitalized a few times since.

Over the course of that time, it's remained a profitable institution. That initial $300-odd million capitalization has grown to a value of $1.4 billion. AIDEA has the capacity to own and operate infrastructure in Alaska. AIDEA owns both of Alaska's deep-sea ports. It has facilitated project development based on partnerships between industry and first nations communities.

Effectively it's been a transformative social and economic development entity for the state. When you factor in the role AIDEA has played in positively effecting responsible economic development in Alaska and then look at the opportunities that are available in the territories, there is a stark contrast.

I'll give you one example. The first project that AIDEA funded was a lead-zinc mine called Red Dog. It came up with a creative capital financing model to fund a port and a road, so that the project viability of that particular mine could go ahead.

We have a lead-zinc mine in Nunavut called Izok Lake. It also needs a port and a road. It's also a deposit that's been known about for 50 years, but it, to this day, remains undeveloped. Meanwhile, in Alaska at the Red Dog mine, there are multiple billions of dollars of private sector–driven economic development that has resulted in jobs and other indirect and induced economic benefits to the state and beyond.

These types of models are not exclusive to other regions. There is great potential for us to learn from these models and tailor them according to the reality in Canada so that we can start to participate in those benefits as well.

[Kyle Peterson, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Is it fair to say that you need not only a trade agreement but also some sort of infrastructure investment to even get into those markets that trade agreements provide?

[Brendan Marshall]

That would be our view, and it would vary slightly based on commodity.

As you know, in the north right now there are a number of different commodities that are being produced, but most of them at present are high-value, low-volume commodities, such as diamonds and gold. The reason is that you can carry the product off the site in a briefcase.

You can't bring base metals in the north to market, because there is no road, no port to load the ship, so there is no viability for that whole tranche of lower-value, higher-volume commodities. It is just not feasible to develop a number of those projects right now.

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

Thank you.

We probably have just enough time for two three-minute questions. We're going to go to Madam Lapointe for three minutes, then for three minutes to Mr. Ritz, and that will tie up this section.

Go ahead.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Good morning and welcome to the witnesses.

Mr. Marshall, I have a question for you. You have not talked about the workforce. You talked about the infrastructure deficit, but do mining companies have trouble recruiting workers?

[Brendan Marshall]

Thank you for your question.

I'm sorry, the earpiece is not working.

Can you tell me what main-d'oeuvre means? Then I think I can answer your question.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Main-d'oeuvre means the people working for you, the workforce.

[Brendan Marshall]

Thank you.

Yes, of course, that's another challenging reality for the mining industry in the north. With respect to mining, it's always important to remember that companies need to go where the minerals are located. There's no choice in that regard. Frequently, minerals and metals in the north are located in remote areas. In many cases, there are no communities immediately proximate to the location of the mine, so human resources practice includes fly in and fly out, generally speaking.

That said, companies aspire to hire and employ to the extent possible local employees, whether it's from the territory as a whole or from indigenous communities that surround the sites themselves. For example, many of these types of relationships are agreed to in an impact benefit agreement with local first nations communities or local indigenous communities before the project is built.

One example would be in Nunavut at the Meadowbank gold mine owned and operated by Agnico Eagle. They have a 37% local Inuit workforce and are aspiring to increase that. At their sites in Mexico and Finland, they have mines that are 100% locally operated with 100% local employees, and that's the goal they're setting for themselves with respect to Nunavut. There are comparable percentages across other projects as well.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

That's interesting.

Do you think you could keep up with an increase in the demand, given the workforce and the treaties or agreements with the indigenous people?

[Brendan Marshall]

I want to make sure I understand the question: do I think there's room for improvement with respect to first nations? Yes.

Yes, I do, and the industry believes that as well. The opportunity to increase employment with respect to the first nations demographic or indigenous demographic is real, and it's something that the industry continually pursues.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

Thank you, Madam Lapointe.

We're going to move to Mr. Ritz for three minutes.