International Trade Committee on Nov. 20th, 2020

[Doug Forsyth]

As I was saying, they are not a carbon copy. There are differences. We are working on some differences that will be material. When the negotiations get concluded, then it will be available for folks to see that while it is transitional in nature, there are areas that will be bilateralized sooner rather than later.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

I know we have had—

[Doug Forsyth]

So it's not—

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Sorry.

[Doug Forsyth]

No, go ahead.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

I know we have had a commitment from the department before to table with the committee the definition of a comprehensive trade agreement and a transitional trade agreement, respectively. I don't believe we've had that yet. Perhaps you can give us a sense of when we can expect those definitions to be tabled and whether we can expect them to be tabled before the end of the month.

[Doug Forsyth]

In fact, I signed off on them not that long ago. I believe they will be making their way to the committee very soon. Today is the 20th, and I would hope they would get there by the end of the month. I will verify when they will get to the committee.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

I'm glad to hear it.

Thank you very much.

[Doug Forsyth]

They are on their way.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

I know you said there would be some differences between CETA and the transitional agreement that's currently being negotiated.

Does that include the removal of the foreign investment protection system in CETA, or would those provisions stand in the transitional agreement that you're contemplating between Canada and the U.K.?

[Doug Forsyth]

Those provisions will continue to apply. In fact, the United Kingdom has already approved them. They were one of the early countries in the European Union to approve the CETA treaty, so they are one of the ones that do that. That was an area, at least in the transitional agreement, where there would be agreement that we could replicate.

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

With respect to CETA, my understanding is that those provisions aren't yet in force because the ratification process hasn't happened for each country within the EU.

Am I to understand that in the transitional agreement between Canada and the United Kingdom we would see a CETA-type deal with ISDS provisions in effect for the first time?

[Doug Forsyth]

No. They will not be in effect because it does require that we wait for all of the EU members to ratify the treaty—

[Daniel Blaikie, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

In the transitional agreement it will still be contingent upon ratification of all the EU partners, and those ISDS provisions between Canada and the U.K. will not come into effect until all of the partners under CETA have ratified them. Am I hearing you properly?

[Doug Forsyth]

That's correct, yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you very much, Mr. Forsyth.

Before we go to round two, given the fact that we started 20 minutes late, I asked the clerk if logistically we could continue the meeting until 3:30 p.m., if that's the desire of the committee and if the witnesses can remain until that time.

Does the committee want to extend it until 3:30 p.m.? Is everyone in agreement with that, providing our witnesses can remain?

[Tracy Gray, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

Yes.

[An hon. member]

Yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Is everyone okay with that? I'm not hearing any noes so I'm assuming it must be okay.

Are our witnesses able to stay that extra half an hour?

Mr. Forsyth?

[Doug Forsyth]

Yes, sure.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Okay.

Thank you all very much.

[Rachel Bendayan, Liberal, Outremont, QC]

Madam Chair, I believe we all have other engagements that we will cancel as a result of this.

If we started 15 or 20 minutes late, would it be possible to extend the meeting by that amount of time?

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Yes, 20 or 30 minutes.

If you would prefer 20 minutes, I think everybody is okay with that.

Let's try to keep the opportunities for everybody to get their questions in and the information that they require.

We'll go until 3:20 p.m., to accommodate Ms. Bendayan.

We will move to Mr. Lobb for five minutes.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I have a question to start. The question is in regard to a comment the Prime Minister made on November 11 to Reuters in an interview. He said, “One of the challenges is bandwidth. The U.K. hasn’t had to negotiate trade deals in the past few decades so there is an issue of not really having the bandwidth within government to move forward on this.”

I know those are his words. I know you folks aren't here to trip him up on his words. It sounds to me like you were at the negotiating table when the news came out of this WTO standing. You made the decision to back away from the table. This was in the best interests of the country, the producers and everybody else that you represent.

To me it seems that there's no bandwidth issue based on the fact that they've negotiated all of these other deals this year. They were able to do a deal with Chile and other countries.

I know you don't want to get into trouble here, so I'm going to ask you to answer any way you can.

In regard to bandwidth, is it your observation that there are any bandwidth issues with the United Kingdom?

[Doug Forsyth]

Thank you for the question, Madam Chair.

I think it is fair to say that during our negotiations with the United Kingdom, early on it took them some time to resource all of their negotiations, and they have been quite ambitious with their negotiating agenda.

I think it's fair to say that it took them a while to become resourced properly and then to go through their prioritization exercise to determine exactly what their top priorities were. It is thus a fair statement that there were times when they experienced some bandwidth problems. That's probably normal.

As you well noted, one of the questioners noted that they had an ambitious agenda, with 40-some continuity agreements that they were trying to negotiate. They managed to finalize a number of them. My understanding is they're still working at another handful or so, and then they have—