International Trade Committee on Oct. 28th, 2022

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you very much, Minister.

We'll move on to Mr. Savard-Tremblay for six minutes, please.

[Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Good afternoon, Minister.

Good afternoon to everyone joining the minister today and to my fellow members.

Minister, the motion the committee adopted to invite you to appear today covered a number of topics. You discussed some of them, but I'm surprised you made no mention of the softwood lumber duties.

In August, you announced that you intended to challenge the results of the U.S.'s administrative reviews of its anti-dumping duty orders in relation to Canadian softwood lumber products. Can you give us an update on the challenge?

Are you able to tell the committee today where things stand?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

Thank you for your question.

It's a really important file. I also want to thank the committee for the very important work and the study the committee did on this issue. That is how important it is.

Yes, we have requested a dispute settlement panel under chapter 10, and I'm looking forward to that work being done. Canada has consistently, even through chapter 19 earlier at the WTO, seen those decisions on Canadian softwood lumber rendered in favour of Canada.

I was able to see some really good recommendations from some of the witnesses who came forward in your study, and also in your report, and I appreciate that.

[Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

I see.

What markers of success have you identified in relation to the process or challenge under way?

Do you have a plan B in case it doesn't work?

Can you tell the committee what other avenues are available if we strike out with the challenge?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

Let me say a couple of things.

With regard to the dispute settlement panels, we're actively working with the Americans to put those dispute settlement panels together, and I think we are making some progress there. There is a panel to hear the legal challenge on the U.S. anti-dumping duty order that was composed just in the last few days. I understand another panel will be composed in another few days.

I would also say that I, as the Canadian minister, am ready to negotiate at any time, but I would also point you to what witnesses have said and what the Canadian industry has said consistently to the Canadian government. They want an agreement, but they don't want any agreement. They want an agreement that is in their best interests, “and it should not come at any cost.” That is a quote from Resolute Forest Products.

I've been very clear. I'm ready to negotiate, and I will, but I will always do it in the conditions that must be in the best interests of Canadians. I am in close contact, as my officials are, so we are going to pursue the channels that are available to us—the mechanisms through trade, like the dispute settlement panel—while at the same time making sure we are always working to take advantage of the right conditions when those right conditions are present.

[Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

You said there would be another panel soon. What's the timetable for that?

When can we expect a progress update?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

In terms of timelines, maybe I can get the officials to provide a quick answer.

[Aaron Fowler, Associate Assistant Deputy Minister, Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

As the minister indicated, the anti-dumping panel under the NAFTA has been composed in the last week. We would expect developments with respect to the establishment of the remaining NAFTA panel in the coming days. We're working with the United States on panel composition with respect to the subsequent challenges that relate to the administrative reviews that have followed.

[Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Thank you.

Do you have a plan for lobbying American elected officials or the U.S. administration?

I realize you'll have to wait until after the mid-term elections, once Americans have voted on every seat in the House of Representatives and some seats in the Senate.

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

Whether it is on this issue of softwood lumber or on all of our bilateral issues with the United States, we are always on top of it because of how important it is to our exporters and to our communities, and to the communities in Quebec in particular, where the forestry sector has such strength.

I would also like to thank the committee for the recommendations that you provided to me in your recent study, the work to diversify our products so that they find markets to be exported to and to ensure that there is investment in and commitment to the trade infrastructure in Canada so that we can move these products into those diversified markets.

I highlight those two because I really want to thank the committee for doing that work, because we actually are already doing that work. We are doing a lot of work to diversify. We are negotiating market access for growth into other parts of the world, and we absolutely are making investments in our trade corridor to make sure that Canadian goods and exports can move easily out of this country to the benefit of our exporters.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you very much.

We'll go on to Ms. Collins, please, for six minutes.

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Minister, you mentioned EDC in your opening statement. The government has promised to end fossil fuel financing for Crown corporations like EDC and BDC. Canada gives out the most public financing to fossil fuels in the G20, and EDC is the worst offender.

The promise was made last year to develop a plan, but so far we haven't seen any evidence that this plan is progressing. Meanwhile, EDC has already been the vehicle for $15 billion in fossil fuel financing just this year.

I appreciate that you may not be the one driving the overall policy on fossil fuel financing, but as the minister responsible for EDC and BDC, can you give an update on what work has been done specifically to advance that plan and what communication you've had with your cabinet colleagues on this issue?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

The commitment to making sure that we are building out green enterprises in Canada with the support of EDC is an absolute commitment. Also, the commitment to phasing out support from EDC is very much a commitment we intend to keep.

The direction I gave to EDC as their minister last year was to make sure they are supporting more growth of those solutions and those companies and those entrepreneurs to build out clean technology. What is really heartening to me is that today they are Canada's largest investor for clean-tech growth in Canada.

That is a direct result—

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

Because I have such limited time, I do want to focus on the phasing out of public financing of fossil fuels. I'm really curious about what progress has been made on that plan specifically.

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

What I would say there is that our commitment is real and that we intend to deliver on it.

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

I really want to see an update on that plan and how it's progressing. I understand that you've made the commitment, but is there any way that you could get back to the committee with an update on how that plan is going and what progress has been made?

It has been a year since Canada signed on at COP26 in Glasgow to stop public financing for fossil fuels by the end of this year—that's international public financing—and this deadline is coming up pretty quickly. COP27 is just a couple of weeks away. Can we expect to see that plan before then?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

Well, I'm certainly happy to follow up and provide you with an update on this very important item, and what I would—

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

That sounds great. Thank you.

On the same topic, as trade minister you're supposed to send EDC a yearly letter on priorities, which is then supposed to be made public. Last year you sent that letter in February. It's now November of this year. We still haven't seen a statement of priorities and accountabilities for 2022. This speaks to me of an issue of transparency. I'm curious about when we can expect to see that letter.

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

I would say it would be very soon. I am very committed to making clear and transparent the direction of priorities to EDC, to you and also to members of the public.

EDC is such an important tool and vehicle for Canadian exporters. I think about the pandemic and the extraordinary work they did in supporting hundreds of thousands of small businesses who got the small business loan. Most people may not—

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

Minister, because I only have two minutes left, can you speak to any of those priorities for EDC? Especially, do they include ending public financing of fossil fuels, both internationally and domestically here in Canada? Will that be part of the letter you'll be sending to them this year?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

I'm looking forward to making that letter public, and I think what you will absolutely expect to see in there is what our government has committed to, which is ending that support for fossil fuels.

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

Thank you so much.

As minister, you have the power to issue binding directives to EDC and BDC as Crown corporations. Would you be willing to use your power as minister to issue a binding directive that would require EDC and BDC to end their financing of fossil fuel projects?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

I talked just a second ago about the direction through strategic priorities to support the growth of solutions that will contribute to reducing our emissions and creating solutions to help fight climate change in clean growth. I think that tool has been effective and is a perfect example. They are today the largest financiers in the country for those clean-tech projects—

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

Since I only have 45 seconds left, it sounds like it's not necessarily a firm “yes” that you'd be willing to do that.

Your mandate letter includes instructions to work with the Minister of Environment and Climate Change to ban thermal coal exports from and through Canada as swiftly as possible. Can you give us a quick update on how that work is progressing?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

It is progressing. We pride ourselves in how we work on a whole-of-government approach so that we really are delivering for Canadians in a way that has us coordinating and working together—