International Trade Committee on March 27th, 2023

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

To my honourable member, that's a very good question that I don't have an answer to.

If my departmental officials do, I'm happy for them to answer. If not, I can also take it back and return to you with an answer, because I just don't have an answer.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Do the officials want to attempt to answer that question?

Mr. Stewart, please go ahead.

[Rob Stewart]

Thank you for the question.

The mandate of Invest in Canada is to promote investment in Canada to develop our industries. Exporting phosphates and other minerals is the priority of other organizations.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Minister, the importance of adding phosphate to the list of critical minerals is an issue I've raised repeatedly. Every time, I'm told that the list is reviewed every three years. Yet an expert witness told the committee that three years is too long and that parliamentarians could put pressure on to speed things up.

I sent a video recording of that testimony to your office on December 13, but I have yet to receive a response. Why don't you update the list?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

Thank you for the question.

As you know, or maybe I'll just share, the development of the list for critical minerals rests with my colleague, the minister responsible for natural resources.

It's the first I've heard from you as my colleague. Of course, critical minerals are very important, as you've heard and as you are also stating. I'm happy to take the input that you've just shared with me to my colleague, who has the responsibility for that list.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

I'd appreciate it if you could check on that, because this isn't the first time we've contacted your office.

Now I'd like to get back to free trade agreements. In your opinion, if Bill C‑282 passes, would it make it harder to negotiate other free trade agreements?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

What I've said, and what our government has been clear about, is that we will not be providing access to supply-managed sectors in any future free trade agreements. That is a commitment that this government has made to the supply-managed sector in Canada.

I don't know if the member is saying to me that they're no longer supporting Bill C-282, because you have been supporting Bill C-282, as have the rest of us.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

That's not what I meant. What I wanted to know is whether this bill would make future negotiations more difficult. I wasn't talking about supporting or not supporting the bill.

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

The Canadian team of trade negotiators is excellent. They are among the best in the world. I think the proof of that is the many agreements that our negotiators have done. We continue to be at trade negotiations around the world. I believe we are able to negotiate strong agreements that provide good market access for our Canadian exporters while we protect supply management at the same time.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Minister, the reciprocity of standards varies from one free trade agreement to another, depending on whether the products are imported or exported. For instance, Canada accepts certain products imported from Europe, but Europe blocks certain Canadian products. Have you ever discussed that?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

What I would say is that it's really important that we do everything we can to help our Canadian exporters get into those markets where we've negotiated free trade agreements. You were with me, Mr. Martel, when we were in Singapore and we did that meeting with the CPTPP partners. You saw around the table how each of the partners in the agreement talked about how the agreement is doing in the report of the committees. Those committees include things that are working well, but they also include things where we need to keep doing the work.

The positive thing is that, as we negotiate agreements, we also have mechanisms in there to make sure that we make sure these agreements are working to the benefit of our Canadian exporters getting into those markets. That is work that we need to always pay particular attention to and keep doing, so that Canadians have access to those markets when we negotiate them in agreements. It's work that has to continue to be pursued with good diligence.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

I'm sorry, Mr. Martel. Your time is up.

We'll move on to Mr. Arya, please, for six minutes.

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

When we speak about the Canadian Commercial Corporation and Invest in Canada, I would prefer to have the chief executive officers of these organizations here so that we could ask them about some operational details. However, since the senior officials from International Trade and Industry Canada are here, maybe I can ask them certain questions.

First, the Canadian Commercial Corporation has been in existence since 1946 and is a prime actor in the defence production sharing agreement that Canada and the U.S. have had since about 1950 or 1956.

However, when I look at the operations and the results of CCC, in 2021 the value of the contracts signed was just $1.35 billion. That's compared to Canadian exports in 2022 of $777 billion, and that is rounding it up. Even for that small number, as the international prime contractor CCC is supposed to help Canadian companies get export commitments, orders from countries—they are not big—for which CCC will become the exporter as far as government-to-government contracts go, yet the amount was just $474 million last year. It's so low.

Even for future plans, if you look at them, I think the value of contracts signed has gone from $1.35 billion in 2021 to just around $1.49 billion in 2025-26. Why is this so unambitious? We have about 15 free trade agreements with around 51 countries, so why is CCC so unambitious in assisting Canadian exporters?

[Mary Ng, Liberal, Markham—Thornhill, ON]

I want to thank my colleague for that very good question.

That $1.3 billion for 400 SMEs is a large part of CCC's clients. These companies normally would not be able to get into those particular procurements. The fact is that CCC is able to, through their government-to-government contracting, create an opportunity for over a billion dollars' worth of transactions for over 400 SMEs in the country. That is terrific.

Now, the CCC is not the only tool we have in our tool box. We have other tools as well to help Canadian exporters grow. I think about the work that CCC has done: helping Canadian companies to build an airport, for example, in one of the CARICOM countries; providing and supplying potash to another country in a significant order of magnitude; and helping a Canadian company to sell helicopters.

I just met with the aerospace association not that long ago, and they talked about how important it is to have this vehicle to be able to do government-to-government contracts in markets where they would not necessarily be able to make those exports to customers. I always say—and my colleague will know this phrase very well, because it comes from our Prime Minister—“Better is always possible”, so we will continue to work with the CCC.

However, I am very pleased with the work they are doing, whether it is in procurement facilitation for defence procurement with the United States or in the government-to-government contracts to build airports, to sell helicopters, to export potash or to sell ventilators or medical devices. That's the work the CCC is doing.

As I said, the lion's share of their clients are Canadian small and medium-sized businesses that would not be able to get into those contracts or those markets if it were not for the CCC.

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

Madam Chair, if Mr. Stewart would like to add anything to that, I'd be interested in hearing that.

[Rob Stewart]

I would just add to the minister's answer that one has to think about this in a portfolio context. The vast majority of our support for trade from the Crown corporations goes through Export Development Canada, which financed and insured $111 billion of exports.

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

Mr. Stewart, with my limited time, let me go back to what the minister said.

I know that CCC is there to help companies export various things to many countries. I know she gave the example of the Dominican Republic and other specific examples, but the entire contracts, the government-to-government contracts for SMEs during the last year represented just $50 million. Compared to the exports of $777 billion, $50 million of government-to-government contracts for small and medium-sized businesses is not even a rounding error. It's negligible, nothing.

I know the numbers are big in terms of how many SMEs they've helped, but the definition of an SME here is less than 500 employees—

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

I will interject, Mr. Arya. If you would like some sort of answer, you have to give them a few minutes or it won't happen. They'll have six seconds left.

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

I give up.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Mr. Stewart, do you have six-second answer?

[Rob Stewart]

No.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

All right. We'll just have to leave it at that.

Monsieur Savard-Tremblay, you have six minutes, please.

[Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Can I steal my colleague's six seconds?

[Some hon. members]

Ha, ha!

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

You just did.