Justice Committee on Oct. 21st, 2010

[Rick Norlock, Conservative, Northumberland—Quinte West, ON]

Thank you.

I have a couple of quick questions. I'm very familiar with Project P in the province of Ontario. I think that's a joint forces operation between the Ontario Provincial Police and the Toronto police that is hosted by the OPP. Are these some of the agencies you would pass that information on to?

[Lianna McDonald]

Yes. We have over 1,100 law enforcement contacts across Canada that we directly send information to. They are definitely in the statistics that we've made available. I'm sure they are available. They're very significant partners with our agency.

[Rick Norlock, Conservative, Northumberland—Quinte West, ON]

You also mentioned that most of the Internet child porn is offshore. However, I'm given to believe by some people who work for Project P that there is a huge market in Canada for people to trade child abuse images. In particular, they share information and trade these images and abusive pictures in the same way that people trade baseball cards and hockey cards. Have you found that in your research and your reporting?

[Lianna McDonald]

Absolutely. Again, when you look at the report, we're dealing with very young children in the imagery. There are a number of closed networks of people regularly trading this type of material.

As a last comment, it's important to understand too that this becomes like a currency. It's not only.... To be able to get a picture, you might have to make a picture--abuse a child--to send the picture. There are people who have this sort of issue, and this is a big problem.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Fast]

Thank you.

We'll go to Ms. Jennings for five minutes.

[Marlene Jennings, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you so much for your presentation.

As my colleague Brian Murphy mentioned, we're very pleased to see the government finally come forward with legislation. It appears that the legislation is the right step in the right direction. It will not solve everything, and probably there will be a requirement later on for further legislative responses, but for now it is a good step forward.

I have basically two questions for you. Prior to Cybertip's existence, coming here as a Quebecker I'd never heard of you, so I'd like to know what work Cybertip has done in order to become known in Quebec to ordinary citizens who would then report directly to you. That's my first question.

Second, you were asked by one of the members of the committee whether the government has approached Cybertip.ca to be the organization that's mentioned in the legislation, and you said that it has not been approached. There are no negotiations going on. In that case, I want to ask Cybertip.ca, through you, what your competition would be, if any. What other organizations within Canada already carry out the same mandate that you do, to the same or a greater extent, and could be potential competitors?

My last question, because I had only three, was whether you have people among the 40 staff who are monitoring sites who are French.

[Lianna McDonald]

Thank you for your questions.

Quebec is our second-largest reporting province, again in line with population. In fact, Cyberaide.ca is the branding and the tip line en français. We also have very close working relationships with the Sûreté du Québec and Montreal and Laval police, so we are carrying out public awareness campaigns in that province. As you know, the challenge is making sure that people are really paying attention and know who we are. We are very committed to raising awareness in that province, and we are actually exploring a partnership right now with the Montreal police service through which we will perhaps plant someone there and then go out and offer prevention and education within that province. That's my first answer.

In terms of the competition, we were set up to do this very specific and narrow function. I would argue that there is not an entity in Canada with the same capacity and capabilities. We have eight years under our belts now in terms of knowledge and experience. I would say that we are the logical agency. I'm hoping.

Finally, as mentioned, in terms of our reporting in Quebec, we deal with a lot of sites and reports that go into Quebec, whether they are websites, luring cases, or other things. So while we're not monitoring in that sense, we are still offering through Cleanfeed and through our normal reporting process those important services.

[Marlene Jennings, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

And they are offered in French.

[Lianna McDonald]

Yes.

[Marlene Jennings, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

Very good, thank you.

And you did an excellent pitch for the government. Once this legislation is enacted, receives royal assent, it starts negotiating with Cybertip.ca.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Fast]

Thank you.

We'll move on to Monsieur Lemay, for five minutes.

[Marc Lemay, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I was very surprised when I read your brochure, because I had never been aware of it. I think the work you are doing is extraordinary. It must not always be easy.

At page 45 of your document, I see only photographs of aboriginal people. Was that intentional? In fact, all of them are in Manitoba. Is that because you only work in Manitoba? Is it because this is the information you have received? There must not be just these children.

[Lianna McDonald]

That's a very good question. We, as the Canadian Centre for Child Protection, offer three national programs. Cybertip.ca is our signature program. Kids in the Know, Enfants avertis, is an education program we offer to every province and every school in Canada, and then Commit to Kids is another prevention program in all provinces and territories. Then we also operate Child Find Manitoba in the province, which is a missing children's organization. So the reason you see the Manitoba children showcased in this report is not at all to reflect that we're only dealing with Manitoba children, but it is one of our smaller little programs that we carry out there.

We do, however, sir, work with the Missing Children's Network and all of the Child Finds and other missing children's agencies across Canada and look for children right across the country.

[Marc Lemay, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Is this brochure, which is very well done, distributed in Quebec? Like Ms. Jennings, I wasn't familiar with you before coming into this room at 3:00 this afternoon.

Is this brochure distributed in Quebec at present?

[Lianna McDonald]

It is, and I take very seriously your concerns and comments about that. We are, as mentioned, looking to establish another office in Montreal. All of our prevention and educational materials are made and put out fully in mass advertising and marketing campaigns right through the province. In fact, I'll just add that the police service of Laval just carried out an important luring arrest that was the result of a report that we did. They did a joint announcement and campaign with us that they distributed right across within their jurisdiction.

However, sir, I take your note, and we will work harder to become better known in your province.

[Marc Lemay, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

I come from Abitibi, but my colleague who comes from Laval has never heard of it either. The Sûreté du Québec has a squad and I think it would be important for this to be in all the schools as soon as possible.

If I stumble on a website that seems dubious to me and I want to make a report, what should I do? Should I go to Cyberaide.ca and then you will look after it? For the people who are listening to us now and who might want to do this, can you explain how it works?

[Lianna McDonald]

Thank you.

What happens is a person comes across what they believe to be potentially illegal or child pornography. They come to Cyberaide.ca. They go in. They fill up whatever information they have and know. We also accept anonymous reports. People come in, they fill it out. It's submitted. Within 48 hours our agency reviews all of the reports coming in, triages that information, and makes sure it gets into the hands of the appropriate police jurisdiction.

So we have two pieces to our mandate. One is making sure that reports go right to the appropriate law enforcement jurisdiction and swift action is taken. In the other we field direct telephone calls right across Canada, and we provide education and prevention. If a mother is concerned her daughter is communicating with someone on the Internet, we provide advice and information to families as well.

[Marc Lemay, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

The site operates 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year?

[Lianna McDonald]

Yes, it's 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year.

[Marc Lemay, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Fast]

Thank you.

We have one short question from the government side. Mr. Woodworth.

[Stephen Woodworth, Conservative, Kitchener Centre, ON]

One short question?

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Fast]

I always like to be efficient.

[Stephen Woodworth, Conservative, Kitchener Centre, ON]

I was hoping for a little more than one short question.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Fast]

You have up to five minutes.