Evidence of meeting #33 for Justice and Human Rights in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was workers.
A video is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Bob Dechert Conservative Mississauga—Erindale, ON
Okay.
Ms. Sayers, you work with indigenous women in this business. Do you know of any under the age of 18?
Spokesperson, Canadian Alliance for Sex Work Law Reform
I speak from experience. In London, southwestern Ontario, sex workers—and we work with Safe Space, an organization in London, Ontario, that works directly with outdoor sex workers. They literally offer a safe space for them to come. In London, the trade isn't predominantly indigenous, but that doesn't mean they're not there. So speaking from experience.... This is really hard for me to answer.
Conservative
Bob Dechert Conservative Mississauga—Erindale, ON
Have you ever met a sex worker under the age of 18?
Spokesperson, Canadian Alliance for Sex Work Law Reform
A sex worker can advertise however they want.
Conservative
Bob Dechert Conservative Mississauga—Erindale, ON
But have you ever met a person under the age of 18 who's in the business?
Spokesperson, Canadian Alliance for Sex Work Law Reform
I don't really ask....
Conservative
Spokesperson, Canadian Alliance for Sex Work Law Reform
Most people I've met have been 18.
Conservative
Bob Dechert Conservative Mississauga—Erindale, ON
Okay.
Ms. Benedet made an argument that I thought was interesting. Ms. Sayers, since you work with people in this industry, do you agree with the Criminal Code provisions that make the sale of sexual services under the age of 18 criminal?
There are provisions in the Criminal Code, which were not struck down by the Supreme Court in the Bedford decision, that say that anyone who's under the age of 18 providing sexual services, communicating for the purposes of selling sexual services, that's still a criminal offence in Canada. Anyone procuring or encouraging or employing someone under the age of 18, that's also criminal. Do you agree with those provisions?
Spokesperson, Canadian Alliance for Sex Work Law Reform
I like to quote Justice Himel's decision where she stated that although those are important issues, child prostitution and human trafficking are not essential to analyze the charter challenge with the women who filed the charter challenge.
Conservative
Bob Dechert Conservative Mississauga—Erindale, ON
Okay, so you're not saying either way whether you agree or disagree with—
Spokesperson, Canadian Alliance for Sex Work Law Reform
I am saying that I agree with Justice Himel's analysis that those are two separate issues.
Conservative
Bob Dechert Conservative Mississauga—Erindale, ON
Okay.
Ms. Nagy, what do you think? Do you agree that the—
Conservative
Spokesperson, Canadian Alliance for Sex Work Law Reform
I'm just asking you a question.
Conservative
Bob Dechert Conservative Mississauga—Erindale, ON
Do you agree with the current provisions of the Criminal Code that criminalize some aspects of underage prostitution?
Spokesperson, Canadian Alliance for Sex Work Law Reform
I agree with what Ms. Sayers said.
The prostitution reforms and the Bedford ruling have nothing to do with underage prostitution. You're trying to steer the debate away from the real issues and the content of Bill C-36.
Conservative
Bob Dechert Conservative Mississauga—Erindale, ON
Fair enough. I'll accept that as a non answer.
Ms. Nagy, do you have a point of view on that?
Founder and Front-Line Victim Care Worker, Walk With Me Canada Victim Services
We agree with that, but we would go further and say that instead of criminalizing we would like to apprehend the child under the age of 18 in need of protection.
Conservative
Bob Dechert Conservative Mississauga—Erindale, ON
Right.
Ms. Benedet's argument was that no one is saying the provisions of the Criminal Code that continue to exist that criminalize some aspects of underage prostitution make it more dangerous for those prostitutes under the age of 18 and therefore should also be struck down.
Am I getting that correct?
Prof. Janine Benedet
Not quite, and that's why, if I may, I just want to clarify.
I'm focusing on subsection 212(4) that makes it an offence to buy someone who is under the age of 18. I'm saying that no one is making the argument that somehow we'd better repeal that provision because it pushes child prostitution underground.
Prof. Janine Benedet
So I'm focusing here not on the child who is selling herself, who is clearly not a criminal in any sense, but the person who is buying that underage prostitute.
Conservative
Bob Dechert Conservative Mississauga—Erindale, ON
Mr. Russomanno, do you agree with Professor Benedet on her argument about the purchase of the sexual services of someone under the age of 18?