Justice Committee on May 9th, 2024

[Nicole Nashen]

Two years ago, long before October 7, when I was the president of Hillel at Concordia, I had been sharing a lot about my activism and the activities we were doing at Hillel on campus, and I posted that we were going to be there at a table in the Hall building. This was two years before October 7.

For hours, every 30 minutes, groups of people would come up from behind us and put stickers all over the material we were giving out, which said, “Boycott Israeli Apartheid”. Finally, after about three hours of this happening repeatedly, two individuals came to find me. I'd never seen them before, but I had been stalked on Instagram by accounts like Intifada1999. They came to find me and they asked, “Nikki Nashen, why do you support Israeli apartheid?”, to which I responded, “I've never met you before. How do you know my name?”

[Tako Van Popta, Conservative, Langley—Aldergrove, BC]

Good. Thank you for that.

I have another question. I'm not sure to whom to direct it, but it's on this concept of equivalency.

We often hear Canadian leaders also mention Islamophobia when they talk about anti-Semitism. I just wonder if that is at all helpful to the conversation about how we manage anti-Semitism.

Maybe I will direct that question to you, Mr. Oberman.

[Neil G. Oberman]

I think that's an excellent question. I thank you for posing it.

To make something legitimate, it doesn't have to be posed against something else. Let me give you an example.

The moon and the sun both exist, but not at the same time. One rises, one sets. However, I can tell you that when you try to say that anti-Semitism must be the flip side of something, it delegitimizes it. It says that it cannot exist unto itself; it must have something else to make it legitimate.

I reject it. It's false. It's a narrative. That is exactly what Nicole said.

There is always a way to wrap up your explanations. It's anti-Semitism, but it's not. It's anti-Islamophobia, but it's....

The reality is this, sir. Anti-Semitism can exist by itself. It exists by itself. It has for 5,784 years. There are more people out there who have tried to destroy the Jewish population. They have enslaved the Jews and have murdered the Jews, but here's one thing that's not going to happen, and this is the message for each of you. These people are our future. We will not accept it. We will not tolerate it. If you want to create new laws, start enforcing the existing laws, and maybe we'll get somewhere.

[Tako Van Popta, Conservative, Langley—Aldergrove, BC]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

Thank you.

Ms. Dabrusin, you have five minutes, please.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

Thank you.

I come to this table in, perhaps, a unique situation for the people at this table, because I'm not only a Jewish woman, but I am a Jewish mother of two Jewish students on university campuses in North America right now.

I really thank all of the students for coming here and speaking. I have indirectly, through my children, been living that reality, and it is so important that you've come here.

I want to thank Anthony for having spearheaded this study, because I think it's really important that we take that moment.... I just want to put that out there.

If I seem emotional, it's because I am. This is personal, just as it is for you.

Yesterday, I heard—and I think you mentioned this in some of your speeches—about holding Jewish events, and then being told they can't happen in that way or that you are seeing them disrupted.

Maybe I can start with Nati. I was going to use the example of the International Holocaust Remembrance Day.

At Queen's were you able to commemorate that day in the same way as you would have in past years?

[Nati Pressmann]

No.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

What was the reason you were unable to do so?

[Nati Pressmann]

We were told it wasn't safe for us.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

Did security from the university or the university administration talk to you about what they could do to make you safe so that you would be able to go ahead as you normally would?

[Nati Pressmann]

We took every precaution possible that they told us to take.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

All right.

If I can ask you, Nicole, I don't know if you had the same experience on the McGill campus, but did you see Holocaust Remembrance Day recognized this year in the same way as in past years at McGill?

[Nicole Nashen]

No.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

How was it different?

[Nicole Nashen]

I don't know of any event that took place.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

Okay. I don't mean to put you on the spot, but do you know why it wouldn't be? Has it happened in past years? Do you know why it was different this year?

[Nicole Nashen]

It has happened in past years.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

Okay. Thank you.

Maybe I can ask the other two, starting with Rachel.

[Rachel Cook]

This is my first year at the University of Alberta, so I don't know if Holocaust remembrance occurrences have happened in previous years, but the day that I walked by the art display with the swastika on it was Holocaust Remembrance Day this year.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

Thank you.

Michael.

[Michael Eshayek]

I cannot answer this specific question, but I can tell you that when we're trying to have events on campus at Concordia, Graham Carr and the administration are telling us that it's not safe for us. The last event we tried to have was the screening of the Nova festival movie, and we were asked to pay $500 for security guards.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

Okay.

On behalf of Hillel Canada, have you seen any universities in Canada that have been getting it right and have been doing the right actions to protect Jewish students on campus?

[Yos Tarshish]

Nobody has been doing enough. I'll start by saying that.

I work at Queen's and I have great relationships throughout the university administration. I meet with people regularly. Do I feel like they're doing enough? No, and I tell them that regularly.

I hear from colleagues.... Often, administrators are friendly. They want to help, but they have no idea. We are in a situation where the blind are leading the blind. No one knows what to do, and it shows.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

Okay. Thank you.

I don't have much time. I wanted to ask about DEI policies. It's come up a few times. Does it properly include Jewish voices as part of it?

I see that Nicole had her hand up. Maybe I can start with you, Nicole.

[Nicole Nashen]

I think it is important that rather than demonizing EDI policies as a package, we need to include Jews in those EDI policies.

My grandfather was born in Yemen. My grandmother was born in Morocco. I am not white, and the Jews who might appear white here are not white either, because when the Holocaust happened and all of them had the same colour of skin as everyone else in eastern Europe, they were still gassed and burned because they were not considered white enough for that society.