Justice Committee on Nov. 6th, 2025

[Patricia Lattanzio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

No, I wanted to move to adjourn.

[Anthony Housefather, Liberal, Mount Royal, QC]

I think we're in agreement with Mr. Brock.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant South—Six Nations, ON]

No, it's not to adjourn; it's to suspend.

[Patricia Lattanzio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

I'm saying to adjourn, Mr. Chair.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant South—Six Nations, ON]

Well, I have my request on the table.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Miller]

The motion from Mr. Brock is to suspend.

There is an immediate vote on that; there's no debate on it.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant South—Six Nations, ON]

It's to suspend until November 18.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Miller]

The subsequent motion would be to adjourn.

On the suspension, all those in favour? All those against?

(Motion agreed to)

We're suspended.

[The meeting was suspended at 6:30 p.m., Thursday, November 6]

[The meeting resumed at 3:40 p.m., Tuesday, November 18]

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Miller]

I call this meeting to order.

Welcome everyone. We are resuming meeting number 12 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights.

Everyone knows the protocol around being respectful around the microphones.

Mr. Fortin, the sound tests have indeed been carried out.

I want to remind members that we are still dealing in the third hour with the subamendment from Mr. Lawton to Larry Brock's motion.

The first panel is composed today in person of Mayor Patrick Brown from the City of Brampton. Welcome, Mayor Brown.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Mr. Chair, I have a point of order.

We do not have a notice of meeting with respect to what you raised. I received a notice of meeting stating that we were resuming the debate today on Mr. Brock’s motions, meaning we were resuming meeting number 12 that was suspended. I expect us to continue with meeting number 12. I have not received any other notice of meeting.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Miller]

I have a solution to propose to bring us back to that format.

I therefore announce the surprise: We have two groups of witnesses, each for a duration of one hour. In the third hour, we will address Mr. Lawton’s sub-amendment and Mr. Brock’s motion.

I would therefore ask Mr. Brock to present his motion to resume—

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Your announcement surprises me. Thank you for admitting that it’s a surprise. Is this normal for the Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights?

I have been in Parliament since 2019, and this is the first time I have seen notices of meetings being submitted unexpectedly at the beginning of a meeting. Normally, we’re notified in advance so we can prepare for the meeting. Personally, I’m not ready for the witness groups you announced.

I don’t know what our colleague Mr. Brock wants to propose, that’s his business. However, I’m glad that Mr. Brock and Ms. Lattanzio can agree, because usually we’re faced with parliamentary obstruction and a war between the Liberals and the Conservatives. I’m glad to know that it’s over, but I’m really disappointed to think that we’re going to have surprise meetings. It seems to me that we could have discussed it among the three of us beforehand.

On Friday, I spoke on the phone with Ms. Lattanzio for an hour. She sent me a long email to which I replied yesterday. We were discussing the motions that Mr. Brock presented on November 6. In the meantime, I received notice from the clerk informing me that we would continue the meeting from November 6, which had been suspended, and that there would be no new notice of meeting.

Now you’re announcing a surprise to me, which means the plan has changed. I think it’s unacceptable and that we can’t proceed in this way.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Miller]

First, I’ll let Mr. Brock present the motion.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Okay.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Miller]

I must admit that this is not the biggest surprise possible. Under normal circumstances, these people would obviously have testified today. All members should have been ready.

Let’s let Mr. Brock present his motion.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Excuse me, Mr. Chair, but what you just said is not true.

You say that I’m not ready when I should be. I never received a notice of meeting concerning the witnesses you mentioned. Don’t tell me this is how it’s usually done. Normally, we receive a notice of meeting and we work according to the content of the notice.

With all due respect for the integrity and competencies of today’s witnesses, they were not included in the notice of meeting. The more competent they are, the more useful they are, the more I want to be prepared.

I find that it’s neither fair nor effective to have a surprise notice of meeting, as you say. It lacks seriousness.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Miller]

Mr. Brock, you have the floor to present the motion.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant South—Six Nations, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I thank Mr. Fortin for his intervention. I too would like to know why we did not receive a notice of meeting with respect to potential witnesses. It's unfortunate that it was not done.

For the purpose of resuming debate on my original motion, which was then amended, which was then subamended, I have a proposal that I have circulated to every member at committee.

I believe we have an agreement to conduct the balance of this meeting in the following fashion.

I move:

That, for the purposes of today's meeting, the committee dedicate two hours to witness testimony on the study of bail and sentencing, and in the third hour, conclude debate on the Conservative motion in relation to the Supreme Court ruling dealing with mandatory sentences for criminals convicted of possession of child sexual abuse and exploitation material.

This motion was presented in both official languages.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Miller]

We will resume.

We had the motion that was proposed by Mr. Brock, which you've read out.

There is no specific amendment on that. Let's go directly to a vote on that motion.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant South—Six Nations, ON]

Unless we have unanimous consent.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Miller]

We need unanimous consent to pass this motion.

(Motion negatived)

Unless someone proposes another motion, we will have to resume the regular programming.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant South—Six Nations, ON]

Resume the programming.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Miller]

Mr. Lawton, please go ahead.

[Andrew Lawton, Conservative, Elgin—St. Thomas—London South, ON]

I would like to be added to the speaking list.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Miller]

Your proposal, Mr. Brock, is to....

Is there no other motion proposed on the table?

Go ahead, Ms. Lattanzio.