Evidence of meeting #13 for Justice and Human Rights in the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was c-9.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Mr. Lawton, I have called the vote. That is my ruling.
We're going to take the vote, and I'm going to ask the clerk to do that right now.
Thank you.
Bloc
Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC
Mr. Chair, could you read the motion before we proceed to the vote?
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Hold on, Mr. Fortin. Just bear with me.
I'm sorry. Go ahead, Mr. Fortin.
Bloc
Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
First, let me congratulate you on your election as chair. Welcome.
I wanted to know whether it was possible to read the motion that we're about to vote on.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
I think the easiest thing to do is to get Mr. Housefather to repeat it, since it's his motion.
Liberal
Anthony Housefather Liberal Mount Royal, QC
Yes, Mr. Chair.
I moved that the committee move to clause-by-clause consideration of Bill C-9.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Thank you.
(Motion agreed to: yeas 5; nays 4)
The motion passes, so we'll now move to clause-by-clause consideration of Bill C-9.
Conservative
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
We're going to suspend for a moment to allow our legislative people to come and our witnesses to attend.
Mr. Lawton, I will hear you at that point.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
I call this meeting back to order, please. If you could take your seats, I'd be grateful.
Pursuant to the order of reference of October 1, 2025, the committee is meeting to proceed to the clause-by-clause study of Bill C-9, an act to amend the Criminal Code regarding hate propaganda, hate crime and access to religious or cultural places.
Conservative
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Just bear with me.
I would like to provide the members of the committee with a few comments on how committees proceed with the clause-by-clause consideration of a bill. I know that most of you are familiar with it, but there are some new members.
November 27th, 2025 / 3:45 p.m.
Conservative
Conservative
Conservative
Roman Baber Conservative York Centre, ON
Well, then you would grant the floor to my friend Mr. Lawton.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Once I finish the opening remarks, I will get to you.
As the name indicates, this is an examination of all the clauses in the order in which they appear in the bill. I will call each clause successively, and each clause is subject to debate and a vote.
If there are amendments to the clause in question, I will recognize the member proposing the amendment, who may explain it. The amendment will then be open to debate. When no further members wish to intervene, the amendment will be voted on. Amendments will be considered in the order in which they appear in the package that each member received from the clerk.
In addition to having to be properly drafted in the legal sense, the amendments must also be procedurally admissible. The chair may be called upon to rule amendments inadmissible if they go against the principle of the bill or beyond the scope of the bill, both of which were adopted by the House when it agreed to the bill at second reading, or if they offend the financial prerogative of the Crown.
During debate on the amendment, members are permitted to move subamendments. Only one subamendment may be considered at a time, and the subamendment cannot be amended.
Once every clause has been voted on, the committee will vote on the title and the bill itself, and an order to reprint the bill may be required if amendments are adopted so that the House has a proper copy for use at report stage.
I thank the members for their attention and wish everyone a productive clause-by-clause process.
I would also like to welcome our witnesses back, as the case may be, from the Department of Justice. We have Chantèle Ramcharan, deputy director general and general counsel, criminal law policy section; Joanna Wells, senior counsel, criminal law policy section; and Marianne Breese, counsel, criminal law policy section.
Thank you for being here today, and I will thank you in advance for your indulgence for what will likely be an interesting meeting.
We are into clause-by-clause now, but as I told Mr. Lawton, I will hear his point of order.
Conservative
Andrew Lawton Conservative Elgin—St. Thomas—London South, ON
I hope that the clerk can provide you a reference on how to acknowledge points of order, Chair.
This was, as you acknowledged in your opening remarks, the resumption of the 13th meeting of this committee. We suspended at our last meeting, and that means there was an item under consideration, which was a programming motion on this committee's work. I realize we had to elect a new chair, and I congratulate you on winning that race. However, there is precedent. If you consult the previous ruling from the Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Development meeting of May 16, 2022, the election of a chair does not constitute a substantive motion; thus, after the chair is elected, the previous matters of business continue.
The dilatory motion that Mr. Housefather moved and that we voted on was out of order. We are still on the programming motion introduced at the last meeting. There is precedent to that effect, pursuant to the rules of this committee, and under that I would have the floor as I did when the meeting was suspended.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Thank you, Mr. Lawton.
In fact, the ruling is that debate on your motion was adjourned because of the resignation of the chair and the election of a new chair, which is why I opened the floor for motions.
Conservative
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
I am familiar with precedent, Mr. Lawton.
I'll say this one last time: You are free to challenge my rulings, as is your right, but don't challenge my integrity.
Conservative
Andrew Lawton Conservative Elgin—St. Thomas—London South, ON
I'm not challenging your integrity; I'm challenging your knowledge of the rules, but I will challenge the chair's ruling.