National Defence Committee on Dec. 6th, 2011

[VAdm Paul Maddison]

That's an excellent question and I thank you for it.

One of my responsibilities in terms of readiness is to always to sustain the high-readiness task group. The high-readiness task group consists of the flag ship, two or three frigates, the underway replenishment ship, and maybe a submarine, along with maritime patrol aircraft and helicopters, all enabling that mission anywhere around the world.

The Department of National Defence maintains what we call a global engagement strategy. This is a recent development, and I think a very positive one, over the last couple of years. What that allows me to do in generating those capable forces at sea is to look at where best to employ them—for example, in the Arctic every year, yes; in the counter-narcotics mission in the Caribbean and the east Pacific, yes; and the forward deployment now in the Mediterranean, yes.

Earlier this year, I deployed a ship across the Pacific to participate in an advanced exercise with the Australians, the Americans, and other Pacific partners, off Australia and then forward to Singapore and to engage in a diplomatic way with our allies in South Korea and Japan.

So we can't be everywhere all the time. But there certainly are places where we want to have a presence and we want to continue to be interoperable with our allies, to be there beside them and to exercise leadership.

When the opportunity arises, as it did in 2009, for a commodore to embark and sail with the Canadian task group, in leading a multinational mission in a counter-terrorist mission in the Indian Ocean, that's a real opportunity for Canada to be viewed very positively by our allies and other regional players. So we will continue to do that. We'll continue to generate....

My responsibility is to set those priorities of where we will deploy and to establish the policy, the doctrine, and the standards necessary to ensure that our sailors continue to be the best and most competent; that our ships are maintained and our systems groomed to that highest degree of readiness; that they go through a very deliberate, measured, and assessed training period to bring the crew and the ship up to that right degree of readiness; and that we continue to provide the right oversight. That's what we will continue to do.

When I look at the future operating environment, I actually see it becoming more complex, more sophisticated, and more challenging. That is something that certainly concerns me as we move forward.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Thank you.

The time has expired already.

I'm moving along to Mr. Opitz.

[Ted Opitz, Conservative, Etobicoke Centre, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Through you to our witnesses, Admiral, Chief, welcome. It's good to have you here. As an infantryman, I love going aboard ship and I think my favourite part of any ship is the wardroom, so it's a lot of fun being aboard.

[Chief Petty Officer, 1st Class Claude Laurendeau, Chief Petty Officer, Navy, Department of National Defence]

Then you're hanging around in the wrong place.

[Ted Opitz, Conservative, Etobicoke Centre, ON]

You know what, I am an amateur sailor, having been in CISM sailing, and I'm here to tell you that the water off Esquimalt is cold.

Sir, with reference to the reserves, we see the numbers here on our reserve and regular force breakdown, but what role do the reserves play with the regular force navy, and how much sea time do reservists generally get?

[VAdm Paul Maddison]

Thank you very much for the question.

The naval reserve in Canada, first and foremost, is a strategic reserve. These are part-time citizen sailors who play a key role in engaging in their local communities and establishing a Royal Canadian naval presence in communities that are far from salt water, who get that message out and allow bridges to be built and dialogue to be encouraged. They allow folks to learn more about their navy, what it does for them, and encourages them to be able to ask the right questions, especially when it comes to choosing to serve. So, first and foremost, that's what our several thousand naval reservists do. We have 24 naval reserve divisions in Canada from coast to coast and, of course, in all of your constituencies, I'm sure.

Having said that, they are primarily involved in strategic engagement locally. One of the principles for our naval reservists is that they must be trained and prepared to go to sea, because at the end of the day a reserve is all about surge and capability when the need presents itself, such as when the militia was surged to support the Canadian Army in the mission in Afghanistan.

So all our sailors in the naval reserve choose a trade as officers or sailors and are trained in those trades. One of the key missions they do for the navy is crew our Kingston-class minor coastal defence vessels, the 12 that we have in the inventory.

What the chief and I are moving toward, because we found that this model is not sustainable, is what we call the “one-navy concept”. I would like to see our naval reservists not only go to sea in the minor coastal defence vessels, but also have opportunities to go to sea in the larger major combatants—the frigates, the destroyers, and the underway replenishment ships—and that our regular force sailors also have the opportunities to sail in our Kingston class. We've begun to do this. I want to create a one-navy mindset, a culture where naval reservists and regular force sailors look at each other on an equal level. I think this is a powerful way to go forward.

[Ted Opitz, Conservative, Etobicoke Centre, ON]

I know those reservists are going to enjoy those opportunities aboard capital ships.

You mentioned your outreach program with reservists, but there's another component to this, the civilian side, which you employ through people like Canada Company, True Patriot Love, and your honorary captain system. How do you do that in promoting the navy to Canadians?

[VAdm Paul Maddison]

Thank you very much.

First, I'd say that when you said civilian it made me think about the public servants who are such an important part of the navy. I'm not only talking about the folks here in Ottawa, but really the fleet maintenance facilities in Esquimalt and Halifax, those civilian workers have a far larger effect for the navy than I think you would see on the air force or army side. These workers are actually critical in enabling the technical readiness of our ships and submarines to go to sea. So when I talk about the defence team in the navy, it's regular force, reserve force, and very much civilians who are the members of the team.

With respect to strategic engagement, we have about 20 honorary captains in the navy, all of whom have volunteered for what they see as an honour. They come from all political sides, from corporate leadership, and from academic leadership, and what they do for us is to act as ambassadors. They energize and activate their lines of influence, and whenever they have an opportunity, they will speak, like the chief or I do, to whatever gathering they're with. It's simply to bring that message forward and to bring feedback to me about ways in which I could better engage with Canadians.

True Patriot Love is a great example of an organization that recently held what was called the Atlantic Maple Leaf Dinner in Halifax. It raised $700,000 for the Soldier On program for our families as well. We couldn't imagine this kind of initiative and leadership by the corporate and public sectors or private citizens 20 years ago. For folks like Chief Laurendeau—and, again, here I recall the recognition of the Forces in the Senate two weeks ago—this sends an incredibly strong signal about the new relationship based on respect and trust between Canadians and their Canadian Forces.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Thank you.

Your time has expired.

Mr. Brahmi, you have the floor.

[Tarik Brahmi, NDP, Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Vice-Admiral, if I understood correctly, you said in your presentation that, as we speak, we have no operational submarines.

[VAdm Paul Maddison]

One submarine is currently at sea. The Victoria went to sea yesterday, as planned, to start trials so that it can be certified to a state of high readiness in a few months.

[Tarik Brahmi, NDP, Saint-Jean, QC]

That means it is in a testing period. There are no operational submarines, no submarines that could be sent out on an operation tomorrow morning.

[VAdm Paul Maddison]

You're correct, sir.

[Tarik Brahmi, NDP, Saint-Jean, QC]

That's what I understood.

We saw in the press in September that parts from the Chicoutimi had been installed in the Victoria to make it operational. Is that correct?

[VAdm Paul Maddison]

Yes, but that's normal.

[Tarik Brahmi, NDP, Saint-Jean, QC]

So that information is confirmed. Parts were removed from the Chicoutimi and installed in the Victoria to make the latter operational. Correct?

[VAdm Paul Maddison]

Yes, that's it.

[Tarik Brahmi, NDP, Saint-Jean, QC]

Now as regards personnel capability, we also read that the number of submariners who are operational and thus ready to work in a submarine had fallen from 300 to 80.

Is that the approximate number of submariners? Are you also confirming those figures?

[VAdm Paul Maddison]

Yes.

[Tarik Brahmi, NDP, Saint-Jean, QC]

With the number of qualified submariners falling from 300 to 80, how can we maintain readiness among the Canadian Navy's submarines despite that radical reduction?

[VAdm Paul Maddison]

The key to solving that problem is to have submariners who are ready to go to sea to train more sailors who can become qualified submariners.

Just to confirm what you've said, sir, when we get to the steady state—which we are on the edge of achieving, with those two submarines at high readiness on either coast, a third ready for operations, and the fourth in deep maintenance—that will require about 420 or 430 qualified submariners, those who wear dolphins on their uniform.

I'm about 100 people short, but what I need to close this gap is, simply and clearly, to have submarines operating at sea to provide the people with the opportunity to actually have the sea time to earn their qualifications. That's what Victoria will focus on as she goes through her workups and achieves operational status. That's what Windsor will do when she does the same later in 2012. My sense is, and the plan is, that we will deliberately but smartly grow the submarine force so that we can sustain the steady state I have described.

My belief is that success begets success, and that as the submarines continue to succeed in operations, this will attract more—

[Tarik Brahmi, NDP, Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you.

What is our icebreaker capability in the Arctic? I understood that our submariners aren't operational year round. They aren't able to surface in the Arctic at just any time during the year because they don't have the capability that nuclear submarines have. We don't have nuclear submarines.

What impact can the fact that Russia is developing its 60-megawatt class icebreaker have on the loss of Canadian sovereignty in the Arctic?

[VAdm Paul Maddison]

Like Canada, Russia is an Arctic nation. And like us, their purpose is to establish a greater presence or capability in the north and to improve that capability.

Russia, like Canada, is very much interested in the advantages of increasing its economic capacity in the north through the Northeast Passage, which is increasingly open for navigation across the top of Russia. But the key in the Arctic, in my view, is to apply the principal tenets of the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea concerning territorial waters and economic exclusive zones, and that when there is contention, as there was between Norway and Russia in 2009, to negotiate the common ground and reduce any tension that might be building.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Thank you. Time has expired.

Ms. Gallant.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and through you, thanks to our witnesses.

On the issue of subs, what role do our subs fill in the context of NATO?