Evidence of meeting #58 for National Defence in the 42nd Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was sanctions.
A recording is available from Parliament.
President, Rideau Institute on International Affairs
My position is that there is ample.... First, as I said, I agree that sanctions should continue but that they should be in the context of a broader strategy, which includes negotiations at various levels, that this has to be tried, and that it serves no purpose to—
Liberal
Mark Gerretsen Liberal Kingston and the Islands, ON
Do you believe that there is any point at which we should engage in a military fashion?
President, Rideau Institute on International Affairs
I think we should do everything possible to avoid that catastrophic scenario.
Liberal
Mark Gerretsen Liberal Kingston and the Islands, ON
Do you agree that at some point we might need to get to that point?
President, Rideau Institute on International Affairs
I don't think it's helpful to go down that road—
President, Rideau Institute on International Affairs
—because then we're talking potentially about a nuclear war that could engulf the world. I think that kind of dialogue is not helpful.
Liberal
Mark Gerretsen Liberal Kingston and the Islands, ON
Thank you.
Ms. Charron, there's been a lot of discussion about the amount of rhetoric that has been flying around and the escalation of tensions. I'm curious. Do you think there is a consistency between what President Trump is saying in the media and what the U.S. military is actually doing? Are the movements of the military operations matching his rhetoric?
Assistant Professor, Political Studies, Director of the Centre for Security Intelligence, University of Manitoba, As an Individual
Of course, he is the commander-in-chief, so the military is going to follow Trump, but I think one thing that hasn't been mentioned now is—
Liberal
Mark Gerretsen Liberal Kingston and the Islands, ON
The military is not following what Trump is saying on Twitter. The military is following Trump based on his executive orders.
Assistant Professor, Political Studies, Director of the Centre for Security Intelligence, University of Manitoba, As an Individual
Yes, exactly.
Liberal
Mark Gerretsen Liberal Kingston and the Islands, ON
Is what he is saying in the media and on social media matching what the actual operations are doing?
Assistant Professor, Political Studies, Director of the Centre for Security Intelligence, University of Manitoba, As an Individual
No military commander will take a tweet as his or her orders.
Liberal
Mark Gerretsen Liberal Kingston and the Islands, ON
Right. Would you agree, then, that the rhetoric and the escalation are perhaps a tool that Trump is using to move people away, maybe, from other things that are happening and that he wants to avoid discussing?
Assistant Professor, Political Studies, Director of the Centre for Security Intelligence, University of Manitoba, As an Individual
Yes, and I think what you should be listening to is Nikki Haley, the U.S. ambassador to the UN, and the comments she made. If you look at the new resolution placing sanctions on North Korea, you see that it is very nuanced. One of the calls back is for the six-party talks to resume. Those six players are key to ending this escalation. That's what we should be focusing on, notwithstanding the tweets we sometimes get from Trump.
Liberal
Mark Gerretsen Liberal Kingston and the Islands, ON
It's safe to say, then, that the rhetoric is perhaps more embellished than the way it translates into what's actually happening on the ground.
Assistant Professor, Political Studies, Director of the Centre for Security Intelligence, University of Manitoba, As an Individual
Yes, and it's exactly what North Korea is doing with its public. If you look at the TV, you'll see that they've brought back Granny North Korea, because she is so beloved by the North Korean people. The testimony just gets wilder and wilder, but what we have to look at is the actual official channel of action—
Assistant Professor, Political Studies, Director of the Centre for Security Intelligence, University of Manitoba, As an Individual
—and that's the UN Security Council.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Stephen Fuhr
We only have a couple of minutes left, so I believe that's all the time we're going to have for questions for you.
Before we dismiss the committee, however, I believe Mr. Gerretsen has a motion with regard to expenditures to allow this discussion to occur.
Liberal
Mark Gerretsen Liberal Kingston and the Islands, ON
I do have a motion here, Mr. Chair.
I appreciate all the witnesses for participating today over the four different panels. I hope we can make sure that everybody is properly remunerated for their participation.
The motion reads:
That a proposed budget in the amount of $ 14,700.00, for the study of Canada's Abilities to Defend Itself and our Allies in the Event of an Attack by North Korea on the North American Continent be adopted.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Stephen Fuhr
Is there discussion on that? All in favour?
(Motion agreed to)
I too would like to thank our guests, our witnesses, for appearing today. We very much appreciate it. We wish you a good day.
The meeting is adjourned.
