No, Madam Chair.
Evidence of meeting #2 for National Defence in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was bourgon.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #2 for National Defence in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was bourgon.
A recording is available from Parliament.
12:50 p.m.
Conservative
James Bezan Conservative Selkirk—Interlake—Eastman, MB
Madam Chair, I gave notice of motion on Friday. I would like to deal with that motion right now when we're dealing with committee business.
I will read it into the record:
That the Committee take note that the Government misled Parliament by tabling a document at this Committee in February of 2019 that erroneously stated that Canada's Quick Reaction Force has been registered with the United Nations, and that the Government has publicly apologized, therefore the Committee is of the opinion that the Minister should issue a written apology to this Committee, that the chair table this motion as a report in the House of Commons, that a copy of the relevant testimony be appended to the report, and that the testimony in question be stricken from the record of this Committee.
Just to go on with that.... I do appreciate the fact that the deputy minister has already sent an apology to the committee. To go to the rules and procedures that govern us as Parliament, I refer to Bosc and Gagnon, 2017. Chapter 1, under “Responsible Government and Ministerial Responsibility”, reads:
The principle of individual ministerial responsibility holds that Ministers are accountable not only for their own actions as department heads, but also for the actions of their subordinates; individual ministerial responsibility provides the basis for accountability throughout the system. Virtually all departmental activity is carried out in the name of a Minister who, in turn, is responsible to Parliament for those acts. Ministers exercise power and are constitutionally responsible for the provision and conduct of government; Parliament holds them personally responsible for it.
On that basis, I still expect an apology directly from the minister to this committee or to Parliament, and, in keeping with actions we have taken in the past, Madam Chair.... We have had to deal with false testimony in the past; we've had to remove it from reports and strike it from the records. Because we're in a different session, I think the best we can do is amend the actual report that has been tabled in the House on UN peacekeeping.
I ask that the committee quickly accept this motion so we can get on with getting the apology directly from Minister Champagne, and ultimately ensuring that the report and our record have been corrected.
12:50 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Karen McCrimmon
Thank you very much, Mr. Bezan.
I see Madame Vandenbeld. Is there anyone else?
Madame Vandenbeld, go ahead.
12:50 p.m.
Liberal
Anita Vandenbeld Liberal Ottawa West—Nepean, ON
Thank you very much, Chair.
Mr. Bezan, as the parliamentary secretary, on behalf of the government, I would like to say that we are very sorry that the erroneous information was provided to the committee.
As you have seen, there was a letter from the deputy minister to this committee, and it explains and apologizes for the erroneous information. As I mentioned in question period last week, it was an honest mistake. It was human error. If there is a need for the minister to speak on this, I'm sure he would be happy to do that without the need of a motion. Perhaps our chair could communicate that to the minister.
It was an unfortunate error, and we believe we have corrected the record. I would suggest that we wouldn't need to have a motion for the government to recognize and acknowledge that an error was made, as we have done. If we need to do more, we could have a communication go to the minister, but I don't think this motion is necessary.
12:50 p.m.
Liberal
12:50 p.m.
Conservative
James Bezan Conservative Selkirk—Interlake—Eastman, MB
I think it is necessary. This is about the integrity of our own committee. We did reference this in our report, and it was presented as evidence, so we do need to have it stricken from the record.
It does call upon the minister, and I think this is important. Part of ministerial accountability is that they are the department head, not the deputy minister. They are the ones who need to apologize, so I do expect a written apology from the minister to this committee so we can move forward and ensure that the reports we are putting out there are statistically accurate, factually accurate, and people can trust the information we are putting out from this committee.
12:55 p.m.
Liberal
Yvan Baker Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
Thank you, Chair.
In this case, an honest mistake was made. I am of the view that when people make a mistake, it is important they take responsibility and do as much as possible to remedy the mistake. I think that's what has been done in this case. That's what MP Vandenbeld has suggested and indicated.
Mr. Bezan, I have to be frank. I am a little bit surprised you are putting forward this motion. When you were in government, there were many instances when people at the most senior levels would mislead Parliament, in some cases deliberately. I'll cite a couple of examples—
12:55 p.m.
Conservative
12:55 p.m.
Liberal
Yvan Baker Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
I have the floor.
When the Tories misled Parliament on G8 spending; when the Harper government erroneously used a quote by the Auditor General that was actually about a different government on a different issue to defend their approach on G8 spending; when a minister, only under a tremendous amount of pressure, eventually had to admit she had altered a CIDA document, a recommendation from the civil service; when Parliament was misled about the cost of the F-35 fighter jets.... I could go on.
In most of those cases, not only did the senior leadership of the government at the time mislead Parliament and the public, but they did not take responsibility or apologize, and in most cases they did not take measures to remedy the problem.
I'm asking you, Mr. Bezan, why are you proposing this motion in the case of an inadvertent mistake, when you and your colleagues did not call for this action when Parliament was actually intentionally misled?
12:55 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Karen McCrimmon
Is there anyone else who wants to speak?
Madame Gallant, go ahead.
12:55 p.m.
Conservative
Cheryl Gallant Conservative Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON
The comments from the member opposite have nothing to do with what is prescient at this time.
It is important for the record to show that we dealt with the information that we had at the time. Because of things we've had happen in this committee in the past, where incorrect information was provided, we have now established a precedent of making sure that errors that have been made, either intentionally or unintentionally, are corrected and noted.
Thank you.
12:55 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Karen McCrimmon
Does anyone else want to speak?
It's quite clear that there is no agreement in the entire committee, so I will ask the clerk to take a recorded division.
(Motion negatived: nays 7; yeas 4)
The motion is denied.
Is there any further committee business?
I hereby adjourn the meeting.