That's a very interesting question that you raised, and it's a very complex situation, obviously.
It's nearly impossible to train out a toxic work environment. You can't put people who have these behaviours and these ideas and give them training [Technical difficulty—Editor] see the light and change their ways. These are typically embedded characteristics of people.
When whatever happens that causes them to leave the military, if they have these characteristics, they often end up getting preference for public service positions. National Defence is a big supporter of hiring ex-military members, and so they should be. The challenge is that those who have those ideologies are then coming in, and it's almost as though they're in a hidden uniform. They're showing up and they still have these beliefs. They're coming into an environment where they are quite comfortable, where they're familiar with things and they have the support of current serving military members. You see that they tend to support one another when they're at the workplace.
Of course, there's a hierarchy within that, but—