Evidence of meeting #23 for Natural Resources in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was reactor.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Serge Dupont  Associate Deputy Minister, Department of Natural Resources
Meena Ballantyne  Assistant Deputy Minister, Health Products and Food Branch, Department of Health
Tom Wallace  Director General, Electricity Resources Branch, Department of Natural Resources

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Leon Benoit

Good afternoon, everyone. Welcome.

We're here today pursuant to Standing Order 108(2) for a study of the Atomic Energy of Canada Limited facility at Chalk River and the status of the production of medical isotopes. This is an issue that is important to all of us at this committee, I know, and that is really important to Canadians across the country. I'm looking forward to the meeting.

Before we actually get to witnesses, there are just a couple of things I'd like to mention. First, I see that the portable cameras have left, so that's good. Second, I understand there is agreement that at the end of this meeting we take 10 minutes to discuss where we go with this study, as well as Bill C-20, which has been referred to this committee. In regard to how we deal with that, if we could do that at the end of the meeting, that would be good.

Mr. Regan.

3:30 p.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

Mr. Chairman, I had discussions with Mr. Anderson. He had actually proposed to meet and have the discussion on Thursday afternoon, so to indicate that there was agreement.... Perhaps he talked to someone else and I haven't heard about it yet.

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Leon Benoit

Mr. Anderson, I see that you want to speak to that.

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

David Anderson Conservative Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK

Just in the last 10 minutes or so, I talked to representatives of each of the parties. Mr. Regan may not have been here yet, but I did ask them if they would be interested in spending.... We can spend some time on Thursday as well. We just thought that maybe after today people would have an idea. We haven't had that discussion at all about where we're going or the future business or direction of the committee, so I thought we'd give more opportunity for it.

We certainly can spend 10 minutes on it afterwards. If people don't want to, that's fine. I don't want to extend the committee meeting any longer than it needs to be.

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Leon Benoit

Yes.

Mr. Regan, and then Mr. Cullen. I hope we're not going to take a lot of time on this.

3:30 p.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

No. This shouldn't take long, Mr. Chairman.

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Leon Benoit

Go ahead, Mr. Regan.

3:30 p.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

My only concern is that if we had the minister here, hopefully she'd be willing to come back after we've heard from witnesses. That would have been the ideal from my perspective--not to have her at the beginning. Obviously, she was available today, and it's great that she's coming, but I think it's important that we hear from witnesses, find out what they are saying, and then ask her about that. If she's going to come back, then I don't see a problem with giving up 10 minutes of the time that she's here for this. Otherwise....

Are you suggesting that we stay 10 minutes longer? There's no vote at 5:30 tonight, is there?

3:30 p.m.

A voice

No.

3:30 p.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

Okay. That's fine, then. We can stay at 5:30 for 10 minutes. I'm agreeable to that.

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Leon Benoit

I wouldn't want to interfere with the time with the minister.

Mr. Cullen.

3:30 p.m.

NDP

Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC

Very briefly, Mr. Chair, committee members will note that earlier we discussed actually inserting the notion of going to the Chalk River facility itself. I think this should be part of our discussion.

I've raised it a couple of times at committee in terms of our thinking and planning about our capacity to understand this issue. I think many members would benefit from an on-site visit. I see that some of my Conservative colleagues are agreeing. I think we could put that in the mix, but I agree in the sense of not cutting the minister's time. Let's move on with things.

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Leon Benoit

Yes, we can include any of those types of issues, of course, in the conversation at the end of the committee meeting. For Thursday, we do have witnesses from AECL and CNSC. At least we have that taken care of, so we can talk about where this committee goes beyond that. That's great.

Now let's get to the witnesses we have here.

Thank you very much for being here today. From the Department of Natural Resources, we have Serge Dupont, the associate deputy minister, and Tom Wallace, director general of the electricity resources branch. From the Department of Health, we have Meena Ballantyne, assistant deputy minister, health products and food branch.

Thanks to all three of you for being here today. I understand you have a presentation to make. It may take 15 minutes or so. I think that will be helpful. Then we'll open this up to questions. Please go ahead.

3:30 p.m.

Serge Dupont Associate Deputy Minister, Department of Natural Resources

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

If you'll allow us, we'll make this presentation. This is an issue that is obviously very serious. It is also a complex issue. We hope it will be time well spent for the committee to go through some of these slides, which represent a bit of what we have learned as we have approached this issue and that give a sense of the global background in terms of both the demand and the supply of medical isotopes.

This will not answer all of the questions that I'm sure the members will have through the day, but perhaps will situate the discussion a bit. I hope it will be helpful to the committee.

Diagnostic imaging, of course, is a vitally important tool in assessing patients--

3:35 p.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

I'm sorry, Mr. Chairman. I know we don't want to delay Mr. Dupont, but Mr. Cullen and I haven't received the slides. Some people have the slides and some don't, and the clerk has kindly gone to get them. We've made a distraction, but if you could just wait a moment until we have those slides, I'd be grateful.

3:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Leon Benoit

Yes, they are coming. I believe they are here. Mr. Cullen and Mr. Tonks also do not have copies of the slides. That, I think, takes care of it. Any of you who do not have the slides will get them.

We have a fairly limited time, so please continue.

Go ahead, please, Monsieur Dupont.

3:35 p.m.

Associate Deputy Minister, Department of Natural Resources

Serge Dupont

Yes, it will be a lot better if you all have the material in front of you.

Diagnostic imaging is critical to assess patients and to determine treatments and further testing. Nuclear medical procedures make up an important fraction of diagnostics, and the vast majority, more than 80%, rely on technetium-99m. This is a technical term, but it's basically the medical isotope that we talk about that is in short supply these days. It is itself derived from another isotope called moly-99 or molybdenum-99, and we will show later how this evolves through the supply chain.

This particular medical isotope performs a critical role in the diagnosis of heart disease and is used in cancer diagnosis as well, through bone and internal organ scans. I'll turn to my colleague from the Department of Health to go through slides 3 and 4, which give you a better sense of the use of technetium-99m, which again is the medical isotope.

There are many medical isotopes. There is iodine of different varieties. Technetium-99 is the one that is in short supply right now, the one we are talking about with regard to the shortage.

3:35 p.m.

Meena Ballantyne Assistant Deputy Minister, Health Products and Food Branch, Department of Health

Thank you, Serge.

The chart on page 3 shows four key messages that I'll leave with you. The overall message is that nuclear medicine is one of many imaging technologies used in medicine. It is used in addition to X-rays, CT scans, MRIs, and ultrasounds.

The largest use of nuclear medicine procedures is for cardiac imaging. That's the biggest share of the pie that you see, about 56%. These scans are used to look at the blood flow through the heart during stress tests.

The second-largest use is shown as the big blue one, bone scans, which make up about 17%. They are used to detect progression of cancers going to the bone, or even just fractures of bones as well. Then all the rest of the uses are general organ scans. As opposed to MRIs and CTs, which look at how an organ looks, these procedures actually look at how an organ functions for a range of diseases, including cancer.

We'll turn to page 4. As my colleague said, Tc-99m, or technetium-99m, which is derived from moly-99, is really the predominant isotope for about 80% of nuclear medicine procedures. It has a shelf-life of about six hours--moly-99 is 66 hours--and that's why there's a supply disruption: it can't be stockpiled like vaccines. The supply disruption right now is of significant concern to patients and to doctors across the country.

There are, however, alternatives that can be used for some of these contingency planning purposes. They can't be used for ongoing replacement, but for most procedures in cardiac imaging--which, as you saw, is the area in which nuclear medicine procedures are most used--thallium-201 is an acceptable alternative, and it is being used now across the country as part of the contingency plans that are being rolled out by the medical community and by the provinces and territories.

Another alternative is 18-F fluoride, which uses PET cameras, another imaging modality. They are being made available through clinical trials for bone scanning. We also have some that are being used by.... The alternative really is to go to MRIs and CT scanning.

There is, however, a requirement for Tc-99m. There are some procedures for which there is no viable alternative. I'm thinking specifically about kids and pediatric bone scanning for cancers. In that case, the medical community and the provinces and territories are taking the available supply and targeting it to the priority procedures and making maximum use of the available isotopes. They're using longer scans, lower dosage, and longer operating hours. They're working weekends, working 24/7 in some cases, and the hospitals and the regions are sharing the patient load and the generators as well.

3:40 p.m.

Associate Deputy Minister, Department of Natural Resources

Serge Dupont

Mr. Chair, I would like to say a few words about the global demand. We are going to focus on molybdenum and technetium.

The global demand is calculated to be about 40 million doses per year. The distribution is on page 5. You can see that the biggest user is the United States, with about 44% of the total, followed by Europe, 22%, then Japan, 14%, with the rest of the world at 16%. Canada uses 4% of the isotopes; later, we will be able to compare that figure to our share of the supply.

Let us talk about the growth in world demand. You see on page 6 that we expect a growth in world demand for this product, a product that is rare now. Demand will continue to increase as the use in present markets intensifies and as new markets start to use nuclear medicine.

Although it is a mature market, we expect that the United States will continue to lead the world demand. There are a number of key factors, but the growth is mainly because of the aging population and the increasing prevalence of heart ailments. Demand will probably increase in Asian, South American and Middle Eastern markets as new diagnostic tools are put in place.

We'll now turn to the supply side of the market on page 7. Much has been said about this over the last number of days. Moly-99 tends to be produced in nuclear research reactors—not nuclear power reactors, but smaller research reactors. There are approximately 250 such reactors around the globe, but there are only a handful that produce moly-99 in any reasonable quantity. Indeed, 95% of the moly-99 produced for export markets comes from five government-owned multi-purpose research reactors. They are the AECL's National Research Universal, which we call the NRU reactor, in Chalk River, Canada; the BR2 reactor in Belgium; the HFR reactor at Petten in the Netherlands; the OSIRIS reactor in France; and the SAFARI reactor in South Africa. There are several other smaller reactors that provide some supplies to regional or domestic markets, but not enough to really influence the global market.

The five reactors working together, or working with regular outages, can succeed in supplying the global market in the necessary quantities. However, the NRU is one of the largest, with the reactor in the Netherlands, producing roughly 30%, sometimes 40% of the global supply, and when such a reactor is down there will be an impact on global supply. Indeed, it's worth reminding ourselves that not so long ago, toward the end of the summer up to early 2009, the HFR reactor of the Netherlands was down. During that period, the NRU at Chalk River ramped up production considerably such that there was virtually no noticeable impact on Canadian demand. Now, of course, we're facing a different situation.

The slide on page 8 shows you a bit of the supply chain and how the isotopes make their way from a reactor to the patients.

First, uranium targets—we call them targets, but they're essentially bundles that go into a reactor—are irradiated. That means they're subject to the neutron beam of the reactor in the research reactor. Then, after some days in the reactor, these targets are processed. The moly-99, which is derived from this process, is extracted and it is purified. It is then incorporated into technetium-99m generators, and that is the product that is shipped to hospitals and radiopharmacies, where it's used in conjunction with drugs that allow the targeting of the radioactive materials that decay very rapidly in the body. The drugs allow targeting that to specific processes or tissues in the body.

The various steps in this process can take place at different locations and different countries, and we'll go through that. What is important is that this radioactive material decays very rapidly. The moly-99 that is produced in the reactors has a half-life of about 66 hours. That means that very quickly, if it is not shipped to the appropriate manufacturer, the product decays and is not as useful at the end of the chain. Similarly, the technetium generator that is shipped to the hospital has a limited useful life that's estimated in the range of 10 to 14 days. The longer one waits, the less effective that generator is.

This is an industry—and we'll go through the supply chain—that cannot stockpile material. It is operating every time in real time, and it has to work very efficiently at moving product through the different steps of the supply chain into the end demand. These products, of course, are subject to both nuclear and medical regulations that are necessary for producing, transporting, using the products, and approving new products, with the intent of ensuring health and safety. The various steps of the supply chain also involve costs and economic risks and rewards. Those are very critical to understanding the full complexity of the supply chain today and incentives for new or replacement technologies for the future.

The chart on page 9 depicts the global supply chain, including the reactor operators, the processors, and the technetium generators, and it shows how the process flows from left to right. If one looks at the top of the page, you'll see that the target irradiation occurs at the NRU in Chalk River for that element of the chain.

The molybdenum-99 is extracted in processing facilities at Chalk River, in what are called hot cells, or areas isolated with concrete to allow very sophisticated manipulation of radioactive material. This material is then shipped to MDS Nordion in Kanata. Nordion, you will recall, was spun out of AECL in the early 1990s. Nordion purifies the product. Importantly, it then exports this product to a number of customers in Japan and in the United States—mostly in the United States, to Lantheus, a technetium generator.

I'll come back then to show the flows of supply from Canada.

The other reactors essentially function the same way, going either through Covidien AG or the IRE, both in Europe—which can actually take supply from a number of reactors—and the South African reactor funnels the material through NTP Radioisotopes, also in South Africa, and it is shipped to different parts of the world.

Of course, the geographic alignment between reactors and processors stems from the constraints in shipping and the decay time of moly-99. While there is crossover between these chains, there is not perfect substitutability of product. It is not a trivial matter of taking something that comes out of the SAFARI reactor to be processed, for example, by Covidien in Europe, or going through MDS Nordion in Kanata. These products are not all substitutable.

If we look at the flows on page 10 as regards Canadian supply, it's important to understand again that the product from the NRU does not go directly to hospitals or clinics. It goes through a number of steps, first, through MDS Nordion in Kanata, as I just mentioned, which ships a portion of it to the rest of the world—and the largest portion to the United States, to Lantheus, and also, in some cases, to other customers in the United States—and it is only a relatively small portion that comes back into Canada. We indicated that the NRU supplies roughly 30% to 40% of global demand. It consumes roughly 4% of global supply. That means the bulk of the production of the NRU is actually exported; it is exported and in fact re-imported, because there is no technetium manufacturer in Canada.

You'll see that the end-use in the United States is at least 10 times greater than in Canada, at about 5,500 in terms of the units we've used here. The U.S. is itself supplied roughly 50% by the NRU—that is, 50% through this chain—and about 50% from other reactors globally.

We are all very keenly aware of the fact that the NRU is 50 years old. What is perhaps striking is that the other research reactors in the world that produce isotopes are essentially of similar vintage, between 42 and 47 years old. Of course, that means the costs of servicing these reactors go up—and, yes, their vulnerability also goes up—and there are also some licensing issues. As you know, the NRU is licensed by the CNSC to operate under its current licence to October 2011—and I'll come back to the work being done to extend that licence. The reactor in the Netherlands, for example, was given a one-year licence to operate in March of this year, after an extended outage it experienced.

Page 12 looks at some of the projects or proposals currently in the pipeline that could supply molybdenum-99 to the global market. The most immediate are on the left-hand side, but in fact even those are the only two that can actually produce within the next months.

The Australian reactor, called OPAL, which has been in construction basically for the last 10 years, is now commissioned to produce and to export molybdenum-99, and discussions are in place for export of that product to North America, including on the regulatory side, in both Australia as well as in Canada, with regard to the actual regulation of the health product.

Argentina has a reactor that it has been using to supply essentially to domestic and South American markets. It may supply some, albeit in modest quantities, to the North American market.

In the United States, the University of Missouri research reactor, also an older reactor, may potentially be brought onstream to produce molybdenum-99, but that is a project at this time and not a specific commitment.

The only new research reactor that is really being constructed at this time is the Jules Horowitz reactor in France, and it is expected to come onstream in roughly 2015.

There are other projects that are essentially at the conceptual stage at this time, and one would count at least five years before they come to maturity. Then there are some projects that may supply some local markets and therefore be of limited capacity or use for the global market at this time.

The proposals that have been discussed in the Canadian context include the McMaster nuclear reactor, which is also a reactor that is 50 years old and is experimental. It's a research reactor at McMaster University that has produced isotopes in the 1970s under different conditions. It has put forward a proposal to produce moly-99, and there has been engagement with McMaster to see how that could be done. But our analysis to date, the analysis of experts from AECL and from the CNSC, is that this could not be done in the short term.

UBC has also put forward a different concept, using an accelerator-based process to produce moly-99 using photo-fission. That has also been noticed as a potential process internationally, as one that merits further investigation, but again not one that is mature enough to produce at this time.

The Canadian Neutron Centre is essentially a proposal for a new research reactor in Canada, and that has been assisted by the National Research Council and would be a multi-purpose research reactor, not only producing medical isotopes.

There are, of course, additional private and public sector proposals out there. Certainly, we suspect we will have some discussion about the MAPLE reactors, which turned out to be not capable of producing and are not licensed at this time. That project was terminated in May of 2008.

The Province of Saskatchewan has indicated it is also interested in discussing with the Government of Canada possible arrangements for a research reactor and, eventually, the production of isotopes.

Perhaps I won't go through the list on page 14, Mr. Chair, not wanting to take too much of the committee's time. But the criteria that one would have to look at, looking at these various solutions, includes the technical feasibility, the readiness, the technological risks associated with the projects, and the ability to expand the technology to commercial scale.

There is business implementation and risks. The investments are very significant. Obviously, if they were to replicate in any way the production levels of the NRU, it would have to count on access to the export market for a large share of its production. This means that market has to evolve in a way that is reasonably predictable, and there has to be some ability to integrate with an existing supply chain. It does not suffice to have a reactor; you actually need to be able to work with a supply chain.

The timeliness of the solution, whether the project could be ready in five years or more, or less.... Regulatory issues have to be addressed, including the ability to handle and control nuclear materials and waste management. The United States, for example, Mr. Chair, has made it very clear that with regard to long-term solutions--not short-term, but long-term solutions--they want those reactors to function on low-enriched uranium in order to control the risk of nuclear proliferation. Currently, the NRU and most other of the reactors that produce are actually using highly enriched uranium, and this is something that the United States in particular, and indeed the international community, would want to phase out over time.

Where there are other broader benefits to Canadians, quite apart from the health care benefit, which is obvious, are the benefits to the medical industry or to the nuclear industry, and so forth.

The next steps in regard to key priorities in trying to address this challenge are threefold. It's also on the demand side, and my colleague from Health Canada may add to that later in the questions.

First of all, it remains a priority to put the NRU back into service and to extend the licence of the NRU. That is the best way right now of ensuring that there's something like the production of the NRU that comes back on stream, and obviously AECL is working very hard at ensuring that can be done as quickly as possible on a safe and reliable basis. It means as well that the work has to continue to extend the licence of the NRU. Funding was provided for that last year, reallocating from budget moneys of 2008. Budget 2009 provided funding again this year for AECL to pursue this work with the CNSC.

The second thing is international engagement so that we secure the best possible capacity out of existing capacity, that we achieve the best possible supply and the best use of that supply globally. That means, for us, engaging multilaterally, engaging bilaterally with the different producing countries, and also engaging with the United States.

Thirdly, the minister outlined last week the establishment of an expert review panel to go over the different proposals I mentioned earlier against the kind of criteria I've laid out.

I hope this is helpful. I'm more than happy to take questions from the committee.

3:55 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Leon Benoit

Thank you very much to both of you for your presentations. They were very thorough.

We'll go directly to the questions, starting with the official opposition, Geoff Regan, for up to seven minutes.

3:55 p.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.

Through you to the witnesses, particularly Mr. Dupont, I can tell you that sometimes we might object to a half-hour presentation. This is not one of those times. I hope I can speak on behalf of all the members of the committee to say I appreciate very much the review you've given us. I hope that as we ask questions we'll expand further on some of these topics.

Let me ask you, first of all, about the substitution issue and some of the alternative suppliers. You've mentioned this issue, the fact that you can't always substitute from one reactor to another system. Maybe you can give an example of that. But if we were able with the NRU to ramp up production when the Petten reactor in the Netherlands was down for several months this spring, what is the likelihood that the Petten reactor can do the reverse for us?

4 p.m.

Associate Deputy Minister, Department of Natural Resources

Serge Dupont

That's a very good question. Let me start with the first part of your question. One example of efforts being made to achieve greater substitutability was actually announced about 10 days ago by Lantheus, to say that they had now secured an agreement with NTP of South Africa and had made arrangements to be able to take the South African product in order to produce the generators for the North American market. We consider that to be a positive development, because heretofore Lantheus had been fully dependent on the NRU, and 85% of the Canadian market was supplied by Lantheus. We had the Canadian market fully dependent, basically, on the NRU. This has now provided a bit of diversification for the Canadian market. That was a helpful development, but it did require some work between NTP and Lantheus to achieve that capacity to take that product.

With regard to your second question, indeed the discussions to date with the Dutch in particular have been very promising in that regard. They are making efforts to ramp up their production capacity by about 50%, and that will certainly be of assistance in helping to alleviate some of the shortages that are inevitable with the outage of the NRU. So we are getting those kinds of responses, certainly from at least some of the reactor owners, and I think there is also responsiveness through the supply chain. There are, however, some regulatory constraints and others that provide that they cannot always operate at capacity. There have to be some outages of those reactors for simple maintenance, sometimes some short outages and sometimes some more extended outages. But yes, the Dutch have been forthcoming, and they recognize the efforts that Canada has made, and I think they consider it now to be their responsibility to do the same thing.

4 p.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

Mr. Chairman, through you to Mr. Dupont, is it true, as has been reported, that the Dutch reactor, the Petten reactor, is to be shut down for the month of July?

4 p.m.

Associate Deputy Minister, Department of Natural Resources

Serge Dupont

There is a three-week planned shutdown at this time. Discussions are still continuing with regard to those plans. But that is where other reactors have to come into play, and the scheduling of the reactors has been an issue that was raised not only in the last few days but has been raised for the past month, including by the nuclear energy agency, to achieve the best possible balance. These reactors do have to undergo some outages, because it's not prudent to operate them longer than what they are licensed to do.

The reactor operators are working together in a forum called the Association of Imaging Producers and Equipment Suppliers try to align those schedules as well as possible. But there will be some periods where the supply will be tight, and that is a fact.

4 p.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

Mr. Chairman, through you again, if normally between Canada and the Netherlands, if I'm not mistaken, the NRU and the Petten reactor produce about 60%, or a little more than 60%, of the world's isotopes,and if the SAFARI reactor in South Africa only produces normally 13%, and I gather that reactor is down this week for some kind of examination, and I hope it will be very short, aren't we looking at a very dire situation in July?

Beyond that, how long do we now expect the NRU to be shut down?