Evidence of meeting #22 for Natural Resources in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was drilling.
A recording is available from Parliament.
10 a.m.
Manager, Emergencies Science and Technology Section, Department of the Environment
There are several techniques for cleaning up oil. Some of those will work in the Arctic, some of them are not as effective.
10 a.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Can we get oil out of ice? That has been a question this committee has been grappling with.
10 a.m.
Deputy Commissioner, Canadian Coast Guard, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
Can you get oil out of ice?
10 a.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
If we have cleanup techniques for an arctic condition, one would assume that we would be able to extract oil from ice.
10 a.m.
Manager, Emergencies Science and Technology Section, Department of the Environment
Right. Certainly things you would use on the open water may not work as efficiently. Skimmers, for example, will plug once you get a certain percentage of oil in the water. In situ burning is a technique that works very well. It works well in arctic conditions, where the cold temperatures will afford you a little more time to use that technique.
10 a.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
But if the oil were under the ice, how would you burn it under ice?
10 a.m.
Manager, Emergencies Science and Technology Section, Department of the Environment
Right. I'm sorry, I'm talking about in the open—
10 a.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Yes, I'm talking about ice-covered ocean. Is there any way to get oil out of that situation?
10 a.m.
Manager, Emergencies Science and Technology Section, Department of the Environment
The oil itself will naturally come up as the seasons change. It will move through the--
10 a.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
So you wait for the ice to sort of... That would take some time, I'm assuming. You wouldn't be able to do it the same season, for example.
10 a.m.
Manager, Emergencies Science and Technology Section, Department of the Environment
It would be difficult in fast ice, yes.
10 a.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
That's interesting.
Madam Fortier, was this taken into consideration when you did your environmental screenings before leasing out to British Petroleum?
10 a.m.
Director General, Northern Oil and Gas, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Oh, yes. There has been extensive knowledge gained. We've looked at decades of concerns about that kind of spill cleanup, and a lot of the research and a lot of the discourse, including the environmental studies research funds, have focused on oil spill response in ice waters.
10 a.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Specifically to the question, can you get oil out of ice? If there's an oil leak under an Arctic drill in winter conditions, other than waiting for the oil to work its way up through the ice, as Mr. Brown said, how would one imagine cleaning that up?
10 a.m.
Director General, Northern Oil and Gas, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
I'm not the expert on the cleanup, but in terms of the public debate and the public concern, it's certainly acknowledged. Definitely look to the companies, the operators, to develop a spill response. Also, internationally--
10 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Leon Benoit
Mr. Cullen, please give the witness enough time to answer the question a little more fully.
Go ahead, Ms. Fortier.
10 a.m.
Director General, Northern Oil and Gas, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
We also leverage a lot of international studies. Very shortly, there is going to be an inter-agency report coming out of Norway. There's continual public attention in trying to find means to clean up these spills.
10:05 a.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
I'm looking at your map. The issued licences that you've given out in the Beaufort are in blue. The Department of Fisheries and Oceans has identified ecologically significant areas, and those are in pink. For the committee members, these overlap one another. In the U.S. they require a four-volume regional environmental impact statement before any leases are tenured. What do we require before you issue a lease in terms of documentation? What do the regulations require?
June 15th, 2010 / 10:05 a.m.
Kerry Newkirk Director, Oil and Gas Management Directorate, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
To first start with the map, you refer to the overlap of the areas of ecologically and biologically sensitive areas that the Department of Fisheries and Oceans has generated. I want to clarify that those areas are not necessarily inconsistent with oil and gas use in those areas. To have identified an area doesn't necessarily mean that what you're trying to protect within it precludes oil and gas activity.
10:05 a.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
What is required? Our understanding is that there's a two-page document required for a strategic environmental assessment prior to you folks issuing a lease. Is that correct?
10:05 a.m.
Director, Oil and Gas Management Directorate, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
I wouldn't have characterized it like that. In the Beaufort, as Mimi has gone over, there are several decades of experience. If we were to look at a new area there would be a more exhaustive study. Every single year the department goes up and talks to communities and talks to other departments, including Environment Canada, the Department of Fisheries and Oceans, and others. We talk to the experts. We do have a fairly sophisticated GIS-based tool, which generates maps such as that and even in more detail, identifying areas where there are go and no-go zones for oil, areas of higher risk aversion, where you'd want to limit activities.
10:05 a.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
You're misunderstanding my question, maybe.
Can you provide us with what British Petroleum provided to INAC before getting its lease? It was $1.2 billion, correct? It was the largest in Arctic history.
10:05 a.m.
Director, Oil and Gas Management Directorate, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Yes.
That lease, though... You're bringing together two processes: the decision on whether it's appropriate to open an area to oil and gas, and what they actually provide us in their bid. What they provide in their bid is a guarantee to spend a certain amount of money over a certain period of time. The decisions with respect to whether or not it's appropriate are taken well upstream of that decision and include an exhaustive and annual process. To characterize that as two pages is a bit limiting. It's actually quite a bit more substantive a process.