Natural Resources Committee on Oct. 2nd, 2018

[Tracey Cooke]

It depends on what the species is and who has regulated it, if it's regulated. In some cases, species are regulated federally under the CFIA, so the emerald ash borer would be one.

In other cases, it may not be federally regulated and the province may be responsible through their forest health program to respond. The Province of Ontario is the only province that has a stand-alone piece of legislation, so it may be regulated under that piece of legislation in that case. I think it's a multi-level government response, and I know that even in cases of regulated species, the provinces are still engaged quite actively as far as monitoring goes through their forest health program.

In other cases, say, with the Asian carp, for example, Fisheries and Oceans would be involved. We come in on that process, not necessarily in a legislated capacity but to help with communication and outreach and, in some cases, engaging our citizen science network to help with monitoring and things like that. For example, in Thunder Bay, I think it was, when EAB, emerald ash borer, was identified there, we engaged our network to go out and do some tree surveying.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

Have you identified any gaps where an invasive species could, in the right circumstances, fall between the cracks, if there's a jurisdictional gap in legislation or regulation or just somebody who's not paying attention to it?

[Tracey Cooke]

That's where risk assessment comes in, and preparing for some of these new responses. We might have to be looking out over the horizon. Beyond Canada and the U.S., we have to look internationally as well, to see what could be the next pest that's coming. We have to get out in front of it, do the risk assessment in advance, and then answer those policy questions. I think that's why scanning the horizon and early detection is important.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

Is there any advice that you would have for this committee as far as the Pest Management Regulatory Agency and so on that we have in Canada goes? When it comes to the use of pesticides and herbicides and all these other things, I hear loud and clear from agricultural producers and others that sometimes we're a little lagging behind other jurisdictions. Is that an issue when it comes to invasive species management in Canada?

[Tracey Cooke]

I do think that there could be more tools in the tool box as far as being able to treat some of these.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

What are the obstacles to those tools being in the tool box?

[Tracey Cooke]

A lot of it has to do with some of the studies that have been done on the impacts of using some of those tools. The U.S., for example, does have a lot more access to some of those tools than Canada does at the moment. I think something we could work towards is being able to have a few more tools for that.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

If you could provide the committee with a list of those differences, it might be quite helpful.

[Tracey Cooke]

Sure, we could do that.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

If you have any recommendations on how to get some of those tools in the tool box, I think the committee would be most happy to hear about them.

I think my time is pretty much up. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

It's right on, actually, perfect.

Mr. Cannings.

[Richard Cannings, NDP, South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC]

Thank you both for being here today.

I want to start with a little clarification, following up on what Mr. Calkins was asking, about your definition of an invasive species and this business of being introduced outside its native range.

We have the mountain pine beetle. I'm a biologist. When I think of something being introduced, I think of something coming in somebody's suitcase or in a packing crate, or carried by some human action, whereas pine beetles flew across the rockies on a nice Pacific breeze. I can see why the mountain pine beetle infestation is of national concern, but maybe you should work on your definition.

We have other things. Maybe white pine blister rust isn't a good example because it's an introduced species as well, but it's moving up mountains because of climate change and attacking white bark pine. Would that fit in that definition?

These are climate change actions. I'm just wondering how you work around that, or whether you just look at something moving and causing economic damage.

[David Nisbet]

Our definition of “invasive” is that it has to be introduced to somewhere outside of its native range, as you've heard, and it has to have potential ecological, social and economic impacts.

For something like the mountain pine beetle, it's spreading further than it ever has before in history. In that case, we would consider it invasive and not just expanding on its native range in a natural process, because some of the factors that led to the spread of the mountain pine beetle weren't natural processes at all. It had to do with the history of fire suppression by humans on the landscape, making the forest much more susceptible to this spread. It has to do with climate change, which can be attributed to human activity. These aren't natural processes that are actually leading to the spread.

[Richard Cannings, NDP, South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC]

I assume a lot of these things that are spreading into Canada, these introductions, didn't arrive in Montreal, Halifax or Vancouver. They arrived somewhere in the United States.

[Tracey Cooke]

In some cases, yes.

[Richard Cannings, NDP, South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC]

Oak wilt is another example of something that's native, I assume, to the United States and is just moving north for various reasons.

Can you comment on how you co-operate or how Canada co-operates with the United States, or should, in a coordinated effort to keep these things out? The hemlock woolly adelgid is an example that I assume came over to the United States from Asia or someplace, and now it's knocking on our door. I have lots of woolly adelgids in my backyard, but they're native and don't seem to do much damage.

Can you comment on that aspect? It seems it would save us a lot of time, effort and money if we kept them out of North America, rather than just worrying about the 49th parallel.

[Tracey Cooke]

Yes, I think when we talked about investing in collaborations and partnerships we didn't mean only domestically. I think that has to happen first and foremost domestically, but it has to also include the rest of North America.

We participate in networks that are North American-wide that have members from Mexico, the U.S. and Canada on them. I know that CFIA and other federal-level organizations also participate in similar types of committees. I think that's definitely happening, and I see shared research happening.

There is always room for improvement and definitely for making sure that information is shared across that border.

Another issue is potentially making sure that the data we have is in a compatible format so that it can be used across the board.

[Richard Cannings, NDP, South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC]

Yes...and across the border.

[Tracey Cooke]

Yes, across the border.

I think there is always room for improvement, so additional investment in working on those networks and collaborations and partnerships, either at the government level or through organizations such as ours, is critical. Then bringing that as a North American approach to the international community is very important when we're stopping new invasions.

[Richard Cannings, NDP, South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC]

Just to switch gears a bit and get back to the mountain pine beetle, Ontario is concerned. Alberta is in the thick of it and Saskatchewan is very concerned.

What kinds of things are you recommending to, say, Ontario to do in advance of this spread? What kinds of things can Ontario do to steel itself for this arrival?

[David Nisbet]

This was part of the case study that we had looked into, doing a risk assessment process and then making some recommendations to the Province of Ontario and in eastern Canada to prepare for the potential invasion of the mountain pine beetle.

We have a number of recommendations. Some of them are regulatory, so Ontario, as a province, could consider regulating the mountain pine beetle as a pest, or regulating the pathway—the introduction of firewood or logs with bark that might be bringing the beetle into Ontario.

Also, it could consider a lot of collaboration with the western provinces. All the on-the-ground action is happening in Alberta along the Alberta-Saskatchewan border, so Ontario could contribute to that financially to slow the spread coming east. It could be in-kind support, sending staff that way to get the training, to recognize the insect and how it spreads, and gain our expertise in eastern Canada.

Research is another key thing that shouldn't be forgotten. The federal government has done some amazing research on the mountain pine beetle already, but there are opportunities to do more research in figuring out how the mountain pine beetle might behave in the Ontario environment. It's never been here before so apart from taking the pine beetles and putting them in Ontario, which I don't think anyone wants to do, it's a challenge to figure out how they will actually behave. There is climate modelling that should be done. There is looking at the types of forests we have and the connectivity of the forests to figure out if the mountain pine beetles could actually establish and sustain themselves here.

Again, there's public outreach, and connecting to communities, especially in northwestern Ontario, which might be at the front line of the mountain pine beetle coming into Ontario. It might be first nation communities and it might be the forest industry in northwestern Ontario, and training them on mountain pine beetle identification and getting more eyes on the ground to detect it early if it does arrive.

[Tracey Cooke]

Part of that was what I mentioned, doing mock exercises. We've held two mock exercises with the province and with other groups—industry and whatnot—to actually go through the scenario of what happens when you find a mountain pine beetle-infested tree and what happens next and who takes the lead.

It's having those types of emergency response mock exercises for pests that are of concern, and obviously those exercises can be catered to a regional specific.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Thanks, I'm going to have to stop you there.

Mr. Hehr.

[Kent Hehr, Calgary Centre, Lib.]

Thank you, both, for your excellent presentation and your detailed knowledge of what is facing this country.

I'm the member of Parliament for Calgary Centre, but prior to this I was an MLA in Alberta. We've seen the devastation of the mountain pine beetle over the course of the last 16 to 17 years and how that is now spreading to Saskatchewan, and we think to Ontario.

I wanted you to think about it in that context. You have said many things that I've tried to take in—an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. You listed a whole menu of things the government should be trying to facilitate when Mr. Harvey asked his questions around what we can and should be doing.

Should the federal government be playing a larger role in this, in your estimation?

[Tracey Cooke]

Yes, I think the federal government could always invest more in some of the networks, collaborations and partnerships that we have. I don't know if that role would be invasive species as a whole, or if you would break it down into forest pests versus other types of invasive species. Definitely, I think it would make sense for the federal government to play a high-level coordination role, engaging all of the partners that are on the landscape to facilitate and make sure things keep moving along.