Natural Resources Committee on Nov. 16th, 2020

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Mr. Labbé, you're going to have to wrap up very quickly.

[Sylvain Labbé]

Yes, thank you.

The market development program needs to be enhanced to develop the value-added products industry in terms of exports. Currently, the focus is on overseas exports, and it is imperative that this program be redesigned to increase the export of value-added products

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Thank you, sir.

First up is either Mr. Zimmer or Mr. McLean, I'm going to guess.

[Greg McLean, Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Let me start by thanking our guests today.

Ms. Yurkovich, Mr. Krips and Monsieur Labbé, thank you for coming and enlightening us on our decisions and our study that we have to do here.

I'm going to start my questions with Mr. Krips.

Mr. Krips, can you talk to me about the proposed clean fuel standards and how you see them affecting your stakeholders in Alberta?

[Jason Krips]

With the clean fuel standards, we are watching that very closely, MP McLean.

We feel that if, done right and set up right, these would be a benefit to our industry, but we are working very closely with other industries that may be impacted by the clean fuel standards and trying to make sure that these are done in a way that's measured and appropriate for multiple industries, not just the forest industry.

We think it is something that, if done right, not only society but also our industry will benefit from it. It has to be done in a very measured way that doesn't cause over-harm to a number of our industries.

[Greg McLean, Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

Thank you.

Can you talk about some of the bioenergy plans? I noticed on your website that Millar Western has an investment in an anaerobic bioenergy platform that I believe was funded by Alberta's TIER program or its predecessor. Is that correct?

[Jason Krips]

That is correct.

We do see lots of benefit to the use of bioenergy, and it's something we are working with. It's not only the TIER program, but also ERA, Emissions Reduction Alberta, that has both industry and government funding that looks to take advantage to move the needle on reducing the carbon footprint. Biomass certainly is something that we are working with our industry on to make sure that we are taking advantage of it. I really feel that the whole bioenergy side of the equation for forestry is just getting started.

[Greg McLean, Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

Can you talk about the contribution from the TIER fund into this type of facility you have at Millar Western?

[Jason Krips]

I will have to get back to you on that specific fund, MP McLean, in regard to the Millar Western operation. We can certainly get some additional information for you in writing.

[Greg McLean, Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

Thank you.

Is there any federal assistance for that program as well?

[Jason Krips]

That I'll have to get back to you on as well. My apologies.

[Greg McLean, Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

As far as the different levels go, you look at the TIER application and Emissions Reduction Alberta, where your members are important contributors to efficiency in your industry and are benefiting from the dollars that come from the large emitters that are recycled into reducing emissions in your industry. Do you see the pancaking of legislation between the federal and provincial governments in how they're approaching the situation with different types of tax, or is there a more efficient way of doing it?

[Jason Krips]

I'll pivot to the programming that is available. I know ERA in particular works very closely with federal agencies to ensure that.... I'm going to go more on the funding side than I am on the legislative side of the pancaking.

I do know there is benefit in multiple leverage points between the province and the federal government when it comes to funding for reducing the carbon footprint. We do very much benefit from that. In working closely with ERA in a previous role, I know there are good synergies between the provinces and the feds when it comes to the program side. In terms of the legislative side, we can always find ways to reduce redundancies and streamline, whether it's red tape, managing a forest or for reduction of carbon.

[Greg McLean, Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

There are two different approaches to carbon reduction. One is the TIER program, which actually has a cost of carbon, if you will, on large emitters, a price for carbon, and the other is a carbon tax at the federal level, and you don't see the two impacting each other in any significant way. Now you'll have the clean fuel standard as well, so effectively, there are three that will affect your industry one way or another—some positively, some negatively. You don't see these being a lot of, as you called it, red tape to weed through at the end of the day?

[Jason Krips]

Certainly our industry is very concerned with the stacking of potential regulatory impediments as well as with trying to move the needle on carbon, and that is something we are watching very closely. I would say that, yes, our industry would be concerned about layering and tiering of different rules and different models.

We have had members who have benefited from the TIER programming and who certainly very much appreciate working with ERA to leverage some of the dollars they receive with respect to that funding.

[Greg McLean, Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

As an industry, do you know how much money you've actually received from the TIER funding for these technology projects?

[Jason Krips]

I don't know offhand, MP McLean, but that's something we can dig into and can provide a written response on.

[Greg McLean, Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

Would you say that your industry has been the main beneficiary of the TIER programming for the large emitters in the province by getting more carbon offsets, if you will, plowed into your industry than into any other industry in the province?

[Jason Krips]

No, I wouldn't say that. In fact, I would say the energy sector has probably benefited more from the TIER programming. We're working with ERA and others to try to leverage additional funding for us. Yes, we're working to get whatever we can, but to answer your question, I would say the energy sector has benefited more from the TIER funding than the forestry sector has.

[Greg McLean, Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

Yet the energy industry is also the main contributor to the TIER program. There's a net benefit—kind of money in, money out, I'd say—probably more so for forestry than for the oil and gas sector. Is that correct?

[Jason Krips]

It is money in, money out, but I would also say that we have a huge potential within the forestry sector to be that carbon sink, and that can't be undersold. The fact is that a healthy forest, a managed forest that takes advantage of the technologies, can actually benefit the economy as a whole. One of the industries that can benefit from that is the energy sector.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Thanks very much, Mr. McLean.

I gave you a little bit of extra time, in part because we're not going to make it to a second round. I wanted to make sure the witness had a chance to answer your question.

Thank you.

Mr. Weiler, we now go over to you.

[Patrick Weiler, Liberal, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'd also like to thank the witnesses for joining us today.

I'd like to ask my first question to Mr. Krips.

You mentioned in your opening remarks efforts in regard to the mountain pine beetle. You mentioned the $68 million in funding from NRCan.

I'm wondering if you could speak a little bit to how important this funding is to ensuring that we have the tools to combat the outbreak of the mountain pine beetle. Also, are there ways we can support the industry to better use these products made from wood infested with mountain pine beetles and market them going forward?

[Jason Krips]

Thank you very much for your question on mountain pine beetle funding.

Members of our industry very much appreciate the joint efforts of Minister O'Regan federally and Minister Dreeshen provincially to obtain that funding. It is critically important. We don't need to look much farther than Susan's jurisdiction and the devastation the mountain pine beetle had in British Columbia.

The fact that we can try to stem the tide is extremely important. When you take a look at Jasper National Park, there's still lots of red there. Our hope is that we can stem the tide on the amount of pine beetle devastation that is starting to move into the Hinton-Edson area. It cannot be understated how important that money is. The collaborative effort between the province and the federal government is, I think, a really good example of our jurisdictions working together.

In terms of the products themselves, we work with a number of our research institutes to try to maintain and enhance the ability to use the wood that has been damaged by the mountain pine beetle. We could always use some additional funding in that regard. The intent, though, and the more important thing is trying to stop and get rid of or reduce the impact of the mountain pine beetle. Really, the fact that this money has been made available is very much appreciated.

[Patrick Weiler, Liberal, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Krips.

I'd like to ask my next question of Ms. Yurkovich.

In your opening comments, you mentioned some of the figures. I understand that COFI recently had a study commissioned called “The 2019 Regional Supply Chain Study”. Could you share some of the major highlights or, more importantly, the implications of that study for our work?