Natural Resources Committee on May 26th, 2026

[Some hon. members]

Ha, ha!

[Eric St-Pierre, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

I therefore thank you for using those terms.

Energy efficiency is often overlooked. Personally, I think it’s an easy goal to adopt. It’s a great opportunity to seize. Can you explain why we should focus on energy efficiency as our primary objective?

[Pierre-Olivier Pineau]

There are two or three main reasons for this.

The first reason is that it costs less to consume less, but it requires adjustments. If it costs less, why don’t we do it? It’s because we lack the incentives and aren’t used to thinking efficiently.

In Canada, fortunately, we have this abundance of energy and batteries. That has led to complacency in our energy consumption. Europeans face higher prices and geopolitical challenges, and they’re much quicker to adopt energy-efficient habits. If we did the same, we’d be more productive. It’s good for the economy in terms of productivity.

We’ve also discussed energy security. On the day there are power outages due to an attack or a tornado, we’ll be much better off in passive houses—which are extremely well-insulated thermal envelopes—than in homes that rely on electric heating.

If we have highly energy-efficient buildings, it will be better not only for productivity but also for performance and safety.

[Eric St-Pierre, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

Thank you.

That's the time for Mr. St-Pierre.

Mr. Simard, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Mario Simard, Bloc, Jonquière, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

It’s very short, gentlemen—two and a half minutes. So I’ll be very brief.

As politicians, we’re often called upon regarding economic projects and industrial development projects. The problem is always the same: who will succeed in securing an energy block. We know that without an energy block, it’s partly a peak-load management issue, and that’s often the case for Hydro-Québec. As Mr. Pineau said, it may also be due to poor energy efficiency management.

I know we won’t fully resolve this issue. However, how can we in Quebec develop practices that are more conducive to getting economic projects off the ground?

Mr. Guay and I—I’ll be brief—met earlier with representatives from a company that offers a peak management battery strategy. However, there must be other methods, other ways of doing things.

How can we support our industrial sector by giving it access to energy blocks?

[Normand Mousseau]

We conducted a detailed analysis of winter peak load management, which shows that we could shift several thousand megawatts or several gigawatts of power by managing thermal storage or an electric battery for a few days.

This is a challenge that is not limited to Quebec. The rest of Canada will also electrify its heating sooner or later, and this electrification will come with winter peak management. So we have to do it.

We believe it will be primarily a technical issue. When we conduct analyses, behavioural changes are minimal when considering a winter peak during extreme cold spells.

[Pierre-Olivier Pineau]

I’m not sure I fully understood the question, but regarding new energy projects, I believe we should let the market operate freely and not politicize energy or industrial development.

We need to tell industries that if they want a block of energy, they must obtain it from energy suppliers like Boralex or Innergex. They need to approach companies that produce energy for them. We also need to tell them not to wait for the government or Hydro-Québec to grant them a block. They must purchase it, obviously in accordance with the environmental regulations specified by the government.

We must let the market take its course. We are already energy-obsessed. It is not up to the government to take consumers by the hand and decide yet again who will have energy. It is up to consumers to take charge and procure their own energy from suppliers.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

Thank you, gentlemen.

We have two additional speaking spots—Mr. Tochor and Ms. McKelvie. We're going to be going a bit over, colleagues, but I think that's all right.

Mr. Tochor, you have five minutes or less.

[Corey Tochor, Conservative, Saskatoon—University, SK]

Thank you, Chair. We'll see how we get through my questions.

Mr. Pineau, are you concerned about the low rainfall that is forcing Quebec to import more electricity from other jurisdictions?

[Pierre-Olivier Pineau]

It's a concern, but it's not such a big problem because, fortunately, we do have interties with Ontario, so we import cheap nuclear power at night. It helps Ontario, and it helps us to keep water in the reservoir. That's why I am in favour of more interties with neighbours to better manage these situations.

[Corey Tochor, Conservative, Saskatoon—University, SK]

How would you square that with the support of nuclear by the people of Quebec?

[Pierre-Olivier Pineau]

We don't really need nuclear power in Quebec at this point, because we have a large supply of hydro. We have multi-year reservoirs—

[Corey Tochor, Conservative, Saskatoon—University, SK]

Hold on. I want to clarify. You just said that you relied on low water, but now you don't want to rely on it, or the province doesn't.

[Pierre-Olivier Pineau]

We rely on access to imports from different places. One place is Ontario. We benefit from the current overgeneration at night in Ontario. Ontario has overgeneration at night that benefits both Quebec and Ontario, because Ontario finds a market for its surplus nuclear power and Quebec finds some sources for imports. Quebec has been doing that for decades.

It's important, but I will—

[Corey Tochor, Conservative, Saskatoon—University, SK]

Is it widely known among the public of Quebec how reliant they are on—

[Pierre-Olivier Pineau]

No, I don't think it's widely known. They rely...partly for their supply, but it's not widely known that Quebec imports so much. Those who look at the system know that.

[Corey Tochor, Conservative, Saskatoon—University, SK]

Do you think the federal government should be advertising and communicating that in Quebec, so there's a better understanding of where its electricity is coming from?

[Pierre-Olivier Pineau]

Yes, everyone should know and better understand the role of interconnections and the diversity of supply.

[Corey Tochor, Conservative, Saskatoon—University, SK]

To wrap up, I have one question. If you had a magic wand, and you had one regulation or one thing to change that would help our country out.... I know you've talked a lot about interchanges and some of the other ones. I'm interested in whether there's one thing the current government isn't doing that should be done in the future. Could you submit one idea?

[Pierre-Olivier Pineau]

For electricity, it's the promotion of one single market design for all 10 provinces. The Norwegian market design was adopted by Sweden, Finland and Denmark. I would say, let's follow that lead and look at Norway and how its market design was adopted by other countries.

[Corey Tochor, Conservative, Saskatoon—University, SK]

Thank you so much for your testimony today.

[Pierre-Olivier Pineau]

It's my pleasure. Thank you for the questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

Thank you, Mr. Tochor.

To wrap it up, Ms. McKelvie has five minutes or less.

[Jennifer McKelvie, Liberal, Ajax, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I think it was Professor Shaffer who said that the federal government has an important convening role and that there's a big role for the provinces that needs to play out. This builds on what we just heard. I'm wondering if you can speak to what those different electricity market structures are provincially across the country. Which ones are best suited for enabling the big capital investments that need to happen for electrification? Who is doing this well in the country, and from whom can we learn?