Official Languages Committee on May 1st, 2008

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I will be putting my question to Ms. Simard. I was surprised when you said that the assimilation rate for francophones in New Brunswick has considerably increased. Yet it continues to be the second biggest francophone community in the country. I thought you had access to services and perhaps even more so than other communities outside New Brunswick. At one point we heard that the strength of francophone communities, what allowed them to remain strong, was their access to services. Everything we have heard over the past few weeks and before that consistently confirms that access to services is what allows a francophone community to remain strong and to continue to make progress.

Have you done any studies with a view to understanding why the assimilation rate of francophones has increased in New Brunswick? Are there any reasons for this? You at least have access to services in French.

[Marie-Pierre Simard]

We have heard several explanations from demographers and specialists. First, earlier, Mr. Petit spoke about migration. In New Brunswick, there is very significant migration from the north to the south, from rural areas to urban areas, where there is an anglophone majority. In Fredericton there is one community school centre. In the parking lot you can hear little children speaking English in the school playground. They don't have easy access to francophone environments outside their classrooms. They therefore become easily assimilated.

Another explanation we have been given relates to culture. Young people become assimilated through American culture, through music, television, and so on. There therefore has to be more of a focus on developing Acadian pride and identity.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

What solutions has your association come up with in order to counter this phenomenon? Do you have the means? Have you suggested or tried solutions in order to counteract this assimilation?

[Marie-Pierre Simard]

Several initiatives are currently being undertaken. For example, one of them is called "Accrocs de la chanson". We try to motivate young people with musical talent to write and perform songs in French, to discover that it is cool to speak, express oneself and live in French. That requires resources. As I already pointed out, even though we have the institutions and the laws, at some point you need something else to sustain things. What gives an institution its vitality is the community. If the community cannot innovate or continue the projects that it began in order to make this its ways of life, then it is limited; it can't just happen once every 10 years. We have ideas but we do not have the means to implement them permanently.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

My next question is for Mr. Lamoureux. Earlier, Mr. Lebel asked you about your statement regarding subsidized community organizations in Quebec. I would say to Mr. Lebel that I also worked for five years in an agency. I was responsible for volunteer organizations. At the time, we developed the model you are speaking about. Of course there is accountability. However, according to our model, there would be a financial base that would acknowledge the value of the organization, the fact that it exists and that it fulfils a duty in this area. That is what you told us. You did not say that were the system to change, there would no longer be any accountability.

[Daniel Lamoureux]

You're absolutely right. I did not at all refer to accountability but rather to the three types of financial support: service agreements—in the health sector there are several of these, approximately 56%—projects, that do not account for a very high percentage; and support for the overall mission, which takes up 60% of the subsidies. There's minimal accountability. This generally amounts to financial statements and a report which looks more or less like this: we were to do this, we did this, period. We don't really get involved in endless paperwork.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you, Mr. Roy.

We will now end our second round with Mr. Godin.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I don't think that what Mr. Petit was trying to say earlier was that equalization payments for programs meant that the people receiving the money were all welfare recipients. I was somewhat affected by that remark. I don't think that's what Mr. Petit was trying to say.

Ms. Simard, in your conclusion on page 8, it states: "That is a striking example—to which we could have added the developments in the santé en français issue and the constant fight to maintain duality in education [...]".

It also states: "Such as: exhausted bank reserves; delays in project implementations; temporary closing of the organizations; decline in services offered; personnel layoffs".

I'd like you to talk to us about these problems that are so important. You are not getting money from the Canada-community agreements on time, and you have to fight with the bank in order to keep your staff. You talk about a decline in the services offered. That is why I wanted you to come before this committee. We would hope that things are better than they used to be, but that is not enough. In your brief you state that things are going well but that you do not have the money that you need in order to discharge your responsibilities. Furthermore, this is affecting the development of these communities. I would like to hear your comments on this.

[Marie-Pierre Simard]

My executive director would like to respond.

[Bruno Godin]

I will try to be brief, but it is something that I could easily spend an entire week discussing.

[Daniel Petit, Conservative, Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC]

Are you related to this gentleman?

[Bruno Godin]

No, not at all.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

But we share a common ancestor, a man named Pierre. He arrived in Montreal some time around—

[Marie-Pierre Simard]

However, he is his member of Parliament.

[Bruno Godin]

Yes, that is true. We both come from the same riding.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

It may be difficult to admit, but it is a fact.

Mr. Chairman, I hope you won't deduct this from my time, okay?

[Bruno Godin]

There are a number of problems. As we stated earlier, the fiscal year began on April 1^st. With a little luck, we will know by July how much we will be receiving. Last year, we were told in August. That means that we are already four or five months into the fiscal year. We are given an advance representing a meager 25% of the previous year's funding on April 1^st, so that we can continue to operate. We make do with very little. Often, we lay people off for the summer while waiting to see what will happen. The current year's funding is provided to us in August. That is five months after the year has begun. We often receive funding in February for individual projects. The money arrives in February for a project that was supposed to begin the previous September, and which must end by March 31^st. We let everybody go because we have no money to pay them, then suddenly the funding arrives. We scramble to find our employees, and many are no longer available because they have found other employment.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

This did not start two years ago, did it?

[Bruno Godin]

No, it is a recurring problem. I am not mentioning it because I want to play politics.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

I don't want to either, but with all the boasting in the media about the Canada-community agreements, the fact remains that you are not receiving the money in time, and that affects your operations. Am I right?

[Bruno Godin]

Yes. I totally agree with you, but the cooperation agreements are touted as extremely important. We can't deny that. It's the process that needs some fine tuning, however. The program will end on March 31^st, 2009, but we know that the agreement won't be signed for another year or 18 months.

[Yvon Godin]

Does Manitoba have the same problem?

[A voice]

Absolutely.

[Yvon Godin]

I believe that it is also the case for Nunavut, Alberta and Prince Edward Island. We must make sure to mention that in the report, Mr. Chairman.

[Lizanne Thorne]

The situation is even worse for us because only five organizations are eligible for program funding. We receive our 25% allotment. Some 10 organizations operate on a project basis. If they don't receive a response by September, October or November, then they have already lost half a year.