Official Languages Committee on Dec. 8th, 2009

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Mr. Fraser, you heard the testimony from the director of the Toronto airport. He believes that these weeks will be like any others. He does not believe he needs more staff; he thinks it will be business as usual.

Personally, I have seen no change. The Toronto airport does not have the best record on bilingualism. We are focusing on the Vancouver airport, but Toronto will be an important entry point for visitors. What can you tell us about the Toronto airport?

[Graham Fraser]

As I mentioned, I feel that the importance of active offer and services in both languages is recognized as an integral part of the customer's experience and not only as a legal obligation. I think it is also recognized that the biggest partner city for the Toronto airport is Montreal. Each day, 5,000 passengers arrive in Toronto from Montreal. To get to the Olympic Games, 50% of visitors will be going through Toronto.

Of course, I was concerned when I heard the claim that it would be business as usual, as they say. That is not the case at all. I feel that the fact that 50% of visitors are going to be transiting through Toronto to get to the Olympic Games is an indication that we need exemplary performance there.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Lise Zarac]

Thank you, Mr. Fraser.

Thank you, Mr. Godin.

Ms. Boucher, you now have the floor.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Good morning, Mr. Fraser. It is a always a pleasure to have you here before our committee. We want the francophonie to be everywhere. We say the official languages, but, in actual fact, it is mainly French that we want to see everywhere, so that our communities get the impression that they have actively participated in these Olympic Games.

We all heard the testimony from the Vancouver airport officials. We were all surprised to find that, for six years, or under two different governments, the Vancouver airport turned a deaf ear to our requests, whether from the Liberals or from ourselves.

Ms. Guay referred again to the fact that there needed to be bilingual staff, that tourists were going to arrive at various airports all over the place, that CATSA staff would have to be called in and that visitors would be searched.

Can we expect this to happen in both languages? That is what we all want, but I would like to know, given how little time we have before the Games, whether you sincerely believe that the Vancouver airport can perform miracles by then.

[Graham Fraser]

I do not have a crystal ball. So I do not want to stick my neck out and make predictions. I personally began to monitor this issue ever since I started this job three years ago. We discussed the matter the second time I appeared before your committee, in 2007. We have consistently worked on this issue since then. We have seen the understanding of the institutions evolve. We have reached a point where I do not want to make any predictions.

I raised my concerns; I mentioned that I was still somewhat skeptical vis-à-vis VANOC and its lack of reflex. Even when I am being told that all procedures are in place, that adjustments have been made, and that volunteers have been identified, if the reflex is not there, it is difficult to make the system operational. The reflex and the leadership are what matters.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

There has been a lot of talk about the Place de la francophonie in Vancouver, those who will be representing us, francophone artists from all over the country. Do you know where things stand today? Do you think that the reputation of the francophonie will be enhanced by our artists at the Place de la francophonie? The federal government and Quebec government have put a little money into it. The federal government invested $1.7 million to ensure that the francophonie is felt everywhere. Have you held discussions about that?

[Graham Fraser]

Yes, I have had both formal and informal discussions with representatives of the Foundation for Cross-Cultural Dialogue, which is responsible for organizing the Place de la francophonie. They faced difficulties during the funding negotiations. There were times when the organizers were unsure of whether they would receive sufficient funding.

Most of those problems have been resolved, and I have been assured that there will be successive performances by artists who are not only francophones, but also from the Canadian francophonie.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Not only from Quebec, but from across Canada.

[Graham Fraser]

Not only from Quebec.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you. There are francophones outside Quebec, including Acadians.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Lise Zarac]

Thank you, Mr. Fraser.

We will begin a second round of questions with Mr. D'Amours.

[Jean-Claude D'Amours, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I would like to thank you for being here with us.

Earlier, Commissioner, you said that you were still worried. I will admit that I do hope that is the case, because I am more than worried.

You have told us today that the Canada Border Services Agency and the Public Health Agency of Canada, for example, have not even made the effort to provide you with a direct, formal response. That raises serious questions. There are real things we have to consider; and I am not only talking about the francophonie.

There are a number of real life considerations with regard to health care. The agency is not even able to provide a formal response to the question of whether services will be offered in French. And yet, people may experience all kinds of health problems wherever they are travelling. This, today, points to a potentially dangerous situation; the danger being that some people might not be attended to in their own language.

The RCMP has asked for an extension. I wonder what it actually means. Truth be told, we have seen that the RCMP reacts after the fact. It seems that they are having difficulties being proactive. We saw some examples of that yesterday in Parliament. Today, you are telling us that the RCMP has asked for an extension to provide you with a response on how it will ensure its bilingual responsibilities as part of its work.

If you recall, I had told you not so long ago that I foresaw many complaints being filed after the Olympic Games, because some people will not have taken seriously the work we asked them to accomplish. Take for example Ottawa. People will be coming through Ottawa before heading to Vancouver. The director of the Ottawa airport seemed to say that few people would pass through Ottawa on their way to Vancouver, but I am convinced that people will be passing through Ottawa.

I am sure you have read the documents. As for retail merchants, things are so complicated. In today's retail industry, staff turnover and bilingual requirements make a complicated mix. For all intents and purposes, it is difficult to set any objectives. There are obligations, but reasons are given from the outset as to why they cannot be fulfilled. Ultimately, justifications are given for why others cannot do their work. A true leader should tell people to do their work.

As my colleague Rodriguez pointed out earlier, there has been talk about bilingualism at the Vancouver airport for some decades, but official results have to be shown. There are 11 or 12 weeks to go before the games. I cannot imagine that a decades-old problem will be resolved within a few weeks and that everything will be fine and dandy at the Vancouver airport.

Commissioner, it is a pleasure to invite you here. We should perhaps have had you come on a daily basis. That might have gotten the organizers to produce daily results. We shall see. If we called you to appear tomorrow, perhaps the RCMP would provide you with an official response. That is deplorable. As I have said, I really feel that complaints will have to be filed, but then the games will already have come and gone.

It is a fact that having people appear before us has produced results. However, is it our job to have people appear in order to obtain results? Things would be so much better if witnesses told us how much things are improving. We always have people appear before the Standing Committee on Official Languages for them to talk about such things as the Olympic Games, but it is to remind them of the work they should be doing in terms of official languages. The official languages are just as much for Quebec anglophones as they are for francophones outside Quebec.

I do not know whether you want to add anything to what I just said. My concerns are even greater when I think about future results for the Vancouver airport. We will have to sit down around the table in March and point out that things did not go as they should have. I would prefer hearing the opposite, but I am more concerned about that today than ever before.

[Graham Fraser]

Madam Chair, I think that the results are what count. I have expressed my worries and skepticism, and I will not repeat what I said.

I would like to come back to one issue raised by the member, i.e., the retail industry.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Lise Zarac]

Mr. Fraser, I would ask you to be brief because the time has almost run out.

[Graham Fraser]

In the past 100 years, Chinese restaurant owners have been able to hire unilingual Chinese waiters who are able to serve clients in Chinese restaurants across the country. How can they serve their clients? By numbering the menu. New waiters, even though they had recently arrived from China and spoke neither English nor French, were able to count up to 100. And as the menus were produced in order to help people who could speak almost no English or French, those new waiters could serve their clients.

I think that if we had the same approach to client services, it would be possible for people who are unable to hold a conversation in French to offer services all the same.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Lise Zarac]

Thank you, Mr. Fraser.

Ms. Guay, the floor is yours.

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Mr. Fraser, despite all my admiration for you, I think that you are getting a little carried away. In fact, if I were to be searched by CATSA officials, I still would not understand anything if they used a menu numbered from 1 to 100.

[Some voices]

Oh, oh!

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

We have met with officials from CATSA, the RCMP and the airports, and they all left us with the same concern: they will not be ready and they are not really taking this seriously. That worries me.

I am also very concerned because Ottawa airport officials have only one person who can offer services in French. And yet I know that people will be visiting the national capital, and will want to visit Parliament during their stay in Canada because it will probably be their only visit here. There will be a lot of people everywhere. We have to be prepared for that eventuality. We should not make people wait. If only a single person is qualified to conduct searches, then imagine if an Air France plane arrives with 300 passengers: she will have a nervous breakdown before she finishes the job. That does not make sense. Those services should be available, and I repeat that they will not be because that is what we were told, and that is of concern.

As for the City of Richmond, that is also worrisome. We see that there is no true will, even if it is only to affix three letters in French outside the oval. That has yet to be done, 12 weeks before the Olympic Games. We are being made fun of. How will they welcome francophones to their city? That is very concerning, Mr. Fraser, especially since they are not even willing to affix three letters in French to the oval and refuse to pay the extra cost. That raises significant concerns.

I have one more question for you. There is not much time left. You stated the following:

Other institutions have not shown the same level of commitment. Members of my staff have been urging these institutions to show creativity to optimize the resources at their disposal.

Which institutions are you referring to? I would like you to name each one of those institutions so that we can apply some pressure on them. We are coming to the end, there is not much time left.

What concerns me is that Canada become the laughing stock of the Olympic Games. That is exactly what might happen, and that would not be a nice position to be in.

[Graham Fraser]

I think that I have already given an answer with regard to institutions.

Do I have any time left?

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Lise Zarac]

Your time has run out.

[Graham Fraser]

I will let Ms. Charlebois speak in greater detail about our conversations with the institutions.

[Ghislaine Charlebois, Assistant Commissioner, Compliance Assurance Branch, Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages]

I would like to point out that the deadline we gave institutions to report back to the commissioner was November 30th, last Monday.

When the commissioner says that he did not receive an official response, that means he did not receive any through official channels, ie, from officials at those organizations. However, our analysts have had a number of conversations with representatives of those institutions. We do know that the institutions acted on our recommendations.

Of course, like you, we are expecting results and we know that those results will be measured on the ground. I think that our staff has done its utmost to exert the greatest amount of influence on the institutions in order for them to assume their responsibilities and meet their obligations. It should be noted that they are expected to meet their obligations at all times, not only during the Olympic Games.

We have reminded them of that during each of our conversations with them. Our staff has met with the various representatives on a number of occasions so that they give this file all the attention it requires.

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Even in Vancouver, we felt that things would not run smoothly. That is really worrisome. I would like to tell my colleagues that I am not defending Canada, but I am defending the francophonie and the French language. Canada is supposed to be a bilingual country, so the French language should be visible everywhere and those services should be provided. The people who will be flying into Canada expect that, and they will be in for a surprise that they might not have been expecting.

Mr. Fraser, if I were in your shoes, I would continue until the last minute, with the help of your staff, to put the requisite pressure on the RCMP, CATSA, the airports, including airports services, and the City of Richmond, on which you really need to exert pressure, in order to ensure that people will be properly welcomed here in both official languages, including of course my mother tongue, French.

[Graham Fraser]

Madam Chair, that is the purpose of our office. We are continuing to play our part to the best of our abilities.