Official Languages Committee on May 4th, 2010

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

All right. Go ahead, if you wish.

[Bernard Généreux, Conservative, Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC]

It will be a pleasure, Mr. Chairman.

Welcome, everyone.

This morning, I'm particularly interested in the people from Manitoba. You discussed integration. Ms. Glover talked about employability. In my constituency—I suppose the situation is the same in the constituencies of many members—when immigrants arrive, they face employability problems. If no jobs are available, it's very hard for them to integrate into the community.

Earlier you cited some examples. At the start of your presentation, you also talked about the number of immigrants. You're now taking in 350, including students. Is there any relationship between the fields of study of those students and employability in your region? Is there a causal relationship, if I may use that term, between available jobs and the studies young people take up? Do you combine those factors?

[Ibrahima Diallo]

The students who come to Manitoba have student visas. After earning their degrees, they are virtually ready to be hired. It is easier to go looking for immigrants and to increase the rate if those people have been trained at Canadian schools and have Canadian diplomas. We don't need adjustment programs; they have already adjusted. They know what snow is and so on.

Once that's the way it is, most of the students who come to Manitoba, I believe, opt for professional training such as business administration, for example. Many students study business administration and, increasingly, nursing, because that immediately leads to jobs. Some sectors are very productive and their job market is expanding. These people have no trouble finding work.

I'd like to talk about another aspect that I touched on very briefly. We should also have programs for immigrants, not just refugees, but also for those who have gone through camps, who have been away from school for a very long time and have never been able to complete secondary school. They should be granted support to complete secondary school and to attend professional schools or university.

The learning centre I just talked about started with 13 or 14 students. It now has nearly 150 students. We no longer know where to put all these people and we need support. We are using classrooms at a secondary college. When there are parent-teacher meetings, classes are suspended until they're over. They need space. This program is working very well. It is taken not only by immigrants, but also by Canadians who haven't completed high school.

I think that's how we can prepare people. We shouldn't think that everyone has to have a bachelor's degree or a master's degree. There are also trades, plumbers and carpenters that aren't trained. These are fields that could be of interest to quite a lot of people because a lot of people are manually inclined. This is a component we should not neglect in integration, having regard to the expansion in these regions.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you, Mr. Généreux.

If you're generous enough with your time, I could supplement with a question for Ms. Sacko.

Ms. Sacko, in your introduction, you mentioned that you take in approximately 300 immigrants a year. You talked about reception at the airport, the assistance and support of volunteers and moral support. You also said they are taught a second language. If I understand correctly, you teach them English.

Is it important for francophone immigrants to learn English? Does that enable them to be functional? Can you comment on that?

[Bintou Sacko]

Yes, it's very important.

As we said, the main reason why a person immigrates is to be able to work and to integrate economically into his or her new country. However, in an anglophone majority province, it will be very hard to take advantage of all opportunities on the ground if a person is not bilingual.

Consequently, we encourage them, long before they arrive, while they are going through the procedures in their country, to start learning English already, if only to acquire the basics. Once they're in Manitoba, they'll be entitled to a language training program put in place by the Province of Manitoba, which is extraordinary. That program is continuously provided, from Monday to Sunday, mornings, evenings, afternoons and weekends. It's flexible and it enables immigrants to really learn the language so they can seize all available opportunities.

However, that does not prevent us from also encouraging them to get involved in the francophone community. How do we do that? We do it with the children. We make sure that all the francophones who arrive register their children at French-language schools in Manitoba. We don't force them, but we simply make them understand that being in an anglophone environment means that the children will learn English because they learn very quickly, but that they will have to fight to enable their children to retain their French.

If one day they want to communicate with the parents who are in the country, that's important. If they become unilingual, that's a loss for the family. So they're immediately convinced when we come along with this approach. We do it with the parents so they can resort to French-language schools.

[Ibrahima Diallo]

With your permission, I would just like to add a brief point concerning training. In nursing and social work at the Collège universitaire de Saint-Boniface, it's absolutely essential that students be able to speak English when they do their internships because that increases their chance of being able to do internships in various environments.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Perfect. Thank you very much.

Mr. Nadeau, would you like to add something?

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

There are some documents on the table behind our witnesses. Perhaps the clerk could have them translated, if that's not already done. We need to have translated copies of those documents.

Earlier Mr. Weston talked about Mr. Castonguay, who we heard from last week. Mr. Castonguay's comments concerned the bilingual belt, not just Quebec, as a place where immigration should be directed, according to his theory or thesis. I simply wanted to clarify that.

There's a fundamental problem. Immigration means there are people who arrive from other countries. As a member of Parliament, for whom one-third of the files of citizens in my constituency concern immigration in various ways, I know that there are Canadian embassies abroad with which we have to fight every time. We have to send a complaint to the Commissioner of Official Languages because we can't get services in French. I can imagine what that represents in relation to promotion of the fact that there are two official languages in Canada, that embassies—particularly in Africa, because that's where a lot of the files come from—aren't even able to answer us in French. We have to insist to such a degree that at some point we have to use English, or else it's the citizen who suffers, for a principle that isn't recognized at a Canadian institution. This is a serious problem.

In addition, when you go to the websites of certain foreign embassies in Canada, you see that everything is in English only and in the language of the country the embassy represents. Nothing is in French.

I'm thinking of the person who wants to immigrate to Canada or at least inquire about the matter... The French fact is poorly represented. I understand the work you're doing, but if efforts aren't made here and there, imagine the result. I really deplore the situation. We come back to this from time to time—it's previously been discussed in committee—but Canada itself is impoverishing the Frech fact fact. It's deplorable.

Ms. Bossé, in your presentation, you made four recommendations. I know that five minutes go very quickly and that nearly a minute and a half may have elapsed, but could you discuss those four elements?

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

It would be excellent if they could be forwarded to the committee.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

I believe she clearly described them in her address, Mr. Nadeau.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

I know, but I'd like her to explain them further.

[Suzanne Bossé]

In fact, the first thing, as we saw in the parliamentary immigration committee, is that we mainly handle anglophone immigration to Canada. It's important that a national immigration policy be put in place in the francophone and Acadian communities. That's the first element. Among other things, that would define intergovernmental and interdepartmental cooperation, which is absolutely essential if we want to achieve success in this file and for there to be better linkages between our communities and government actions.

Second, when we refer to interdepartmental cooperation, Citizenship and Immigration Canada, Human Resources and Skills Development Canada and Industry Canada must work together to develop a plan for the economic integration of francophone immigrants. Among other things, we're talking about recognizing credentials and relaxing the criteria of certain programs that, at times, may undermine advances in the file.

There's also the comprehensive evaluation framework. Earlier we were wondering what should be done and what investments are being made. I think that, after five or six years, the time has definitely come for a comprehensive evaluation of the actual impact of the strategy put in place by the government. Currently, we don't have an evaluation framework, and that's why we would like one.

The parliamentary committee should also include francophone immigration in all its studies and committee meetings.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

You're talking about the parliamentary committee on immigration?

[Suzanne Bossé]

Yes, on immigration.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

So you want that to go beyond the framework of official languages?

[Suzanne Bossé]

That's correct.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you, Mr. Nadeau.

Our witnesses' addresses are now complete.

Ms. Bossé, my analyst tells me you've published a compendium of best immigration practices. Is that the case?

[Suzanne Bossé]

Do you want to answer that?

[Sylvie Moreau]

Yes.

In fact, that's part of an initiative carried out in cooperation with Citizenship and Immigration Canada and Metropolis in the context of the Ministerial Conference of the Canadian Francophonie. That initiative was launched on March 18 in Montreal.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Would it be possible to have a copy for members? We're going to add that.

Thanks very much to our witnesses.

Ms. Martin-Laforge, would you like to add something?

[Sylvia Martin-Laforge]

I just wanted to say in answer to the questions around investments that I think it's important for our community, the English-speaking community, to say that investments are necessary.

What are the investments? To start with, it's a new way of thinking about things--not even money--a new way of examining the English-speaking community in Quebec to see how investments could be made and, down the road, something else. But I think that CIC has to consider investments in Quebec, because right now PCH is about the only department that is helping us even a bit on this.

I think investment is really important. I'm sorry to push this at the last minute, but I think that's the message we're giving: investment in Quebec.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

We're going to suspend the sitting for a few minutes to enable our witnesses to leave.

There remain two items of committee business. First, there is a motion. Second, there are budget appropriations, which are important for the proper operation of our committee.

So we'll suspend the sitting for a few minutes.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Let's resume. We have a motion that has been introduced in due form. I would ask Mr. Bélanger to come and present his motion.

Mr. Bélanger, go ahead, please.

[Mauril Bélanger, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

It's quite simple, Mr. Chairman. We're dealing with a highly complex, vast and very important matter, and I would hope the minister would join us for two hours rather than just one. That's the gist of the motion.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

The motion reads as follows:

That the meeting of May 25th, 2010, pertaining to the study of the Roadmap 2008-2013 be televised and that the Minister of Canadian Heritage and Official Languages be invited to appear before the Committee for the full duration of the meeting.

Are there any questions or comments on that?

Ms. Glover, go ahead, please.