Official Languages Committee on Feb. 16th, 2012

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

The department has not yet decided whether there will be another roadmap. In fact, you're not talking about its renewal.

[Hubert Lussier]

What you are looking for doesn't seem to go against what we are doing. Something will follow the roadmap. The government must continue to take action in official languages. As for whether it will be known as the roadmap or by another name…

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Unless I'm mistaken, I think that Part VII of the Official Languages Act states that the population must be consulted when there are changes in view. It's not the members here who need to be consulted.

[Hubert Lussier]

You're right, and that's why…

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

And by that, I don't mean that you shouldn't consult us.

[Hubert Lussier]

With respect to what could follow on the roadmap, it's completely clear that, during our consultations, aside from this one, we listen. When communities talk to us about these matters, we are always there for them. In fact, we are fairly fond of information that can help us provide advice on the follow-up to this program.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you, Mr. Lussier.

Mr. Gourde, the floor is yours.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lotbinière—Chutes-de-la-Chaudière, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Gauthier, Mr. Lussier and Mr. Déry, thank you for being here this morning.

Is our study important in the context of your work and future consultations? I'm sure you listen to the witnesses who appear before this committee, but do you contact them afterwards? Do you analyze everything they say and, if so, how do you go about it?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

Basically, we review what is said. There are two perspectives. First, we try to find out how what exists worked. The approach is rather retrospective. It's an evaluation, in some way. Then, we listen to the needs and possible emerging trends that, in some cases, show up in the testimonies.

Clearly, by focusing attentively on what is said, we are trying to extract the substance of all the testimonies and understand what in the roadmap worked well. We are also trying to determine what future action we could take. In that respect, there is other input, and there are other opportunities or forums. For example, we are looking at the community strategic documentation. These people create their own strategic plans or determine their priorities. There is a national strategic plan and plans in the provinces and territories. It's part of all the data that combines to create a picture of the needs, interests and priorities of the communities. It enables us to think about how best to respond to them.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lotbinière—Chutes-de-la-Chaudière, QC]

Based on the work we have done, are there other organizations that would be interested in testifying before us to give us more detail about their needs?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

I've reviewed the work done by the committee to date. I need to acknowledge that you've done a lot. You've heard from a lot of very relevant stakeholders. There are numerous organizations within the communities. So the committee will be able to choose the level of detail it wants to give to this. Some organizations are very specific. As a general comment, it seems to me that, so far, the number of witnesses from the anglophone minority community in Quebec has been more limited. But your work isn't done yet.

We give a great deal of attention to organizations that focus on linguistic duality. These are organizations that we engage, that we want to listen to. In terms of official languages, we give importance to the minority communities, as well as to the promotion of official languages in general.

In short, these are certainly sources of information that we are going to try to look at.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lotbinière—Chutes-de-la-Chaudière, QC]

I learned from your presentation that a lot of good work is being done with the school community centres, both for francophones and anglophones. We know that the entire school sector is under provincial jurisdiction.

What is our relationship with the provinces? Is it good when we want to establish these kinds of things?

[Hubert Lussier]

You're right that education is a provincial matter. We support the provinces in taking care of their responsibilities. In the case of a school/community centre, we do it because it is community based, but it is also education based because the draw that these centres have for parents boosts school recruitment with the potential clientele and increases the quality and quantity of after-school activities, which are essential for the quality of the child's school experience.

I'd say our relationships are very good. We are in touch with the CMEC for the negotiations my colleague Yvan Déry mentioned in his presentation. The negotiations are about to resume. We have regular bilateral exchanges, we have bilateral agreements with the 13 provinces and territories that guide where we choose to invest and that give the results that we tried to give you a sample of.

[Yvan Déry]

The relationships between the federal government, Canadian Heritage and the departments of education are good. Work is also going very well between the provincial governments and the francophone school boards. If we consider the fact that the francophone population is scattered across the country, we can say that it's provincial jurisdiction, but in the plural. In fact, it's all the provinces and all the territories. A tripartite committee has existed since the mid-2000s. The department of education for each of the anglophone provinces and the school boards meet and share expertise and information. Educational resources developed in Ontario for the francophone schools will be used in Saskatchewan and Manitoba. We are going to work on this type of matter. Canadian Heritage, with the Fédération nationale des conseils scolaires francophones, was kind of an instigator when it came to these meetings. We are interested and amused observers because the ball has been thrown. People bring their willingness, and the governments work together to move the minority language education file forward.

Good things are happening in Quebec, including the expansion of the development of community learning centres. We started with about a dozen centres less than 10 years ago; there are now 37, with more constantly being added. There's a real passion. Even if it doesn't make the news, there's a real passion. Something's really happening with minority education across the country.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lotbinière—Chutes-de-la-Chaudière, QC]

It may be difficult to answer my next question. When we send money or the school boards receive money from the roadmap, do the provinces opt out for about the same amount when services they could have offered themselves are involved, or is it really complementary? Can it be determined?

[Yvan Déry]

The reason why the federal government got involved in these issues dates back to the early 1970s. It started from the acknowledgement that implementing a minority education system would cost much more than making do with providing education to young minority language speakers in the majority system. This meant that additional costs and the federal government were going to help the provinces assume these additional costs.

School boards across the country, minority schools, the parties, offices of the departments of education that develop learning material, all that incurs additional costs. Our help in this respect is at most 50% of the budget. In a lot of cases, the provinces dedicate much more money to it than we do. Is that a disengagement? You might think so because there's a constitutional obligation to guarantee minority education. But constant effort is needed to provide a quality education, to ensure that the role of the school is more than just education, as the Supreme Court has told us a number of times.

The minority school is a community, a home. It's the anchor of an entire community. The dual, if not triple, mission of the minority school often transcends the jurisdiction of a department of education. So federal support is important. The effort of the provinces is also sustained.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you, Mr. Déry.

Mr. Bélanger, it's your turn.

[Mauril Bélanger, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

The summative evaluations were to be done between November and February. Have they been completed?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

Only one small one has been completed. The others are behind schedule. The last time I checked, I saw that we were talking about March, May and June. So we'll have the…

[Mauril Bélanger, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

This would be the last year for the roadmap. Do you think that's reasonable?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

I find it a little unfortunate, but… There are delays.

[Mauril Bélanger, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

Okay. Can we know who asked questions and to whom, what those questions were and what the answers were?

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

As part of the evaluation?

[Mauril Bélanger, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

I'm talking about the summative evaluations.

[Jean-Pierre Gauthier]

Today we're going to receive the evaluations that we were to submit to you. They will show the parameters. As for the questions and the answers, that's part of the evaluators' notes. I'll see what they have. Their material is different from mine.