Official Languages Committee on Oct. 27th, 2016

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Welcome to this meeting, Minister and colleagues.

We are continuing our study.

This morning, we have the pleasure of welcoming the Minister of Canadian Heritage and Minister Responsible for Official Languages. She will speak to us for a few minutes about her vision of official languages and the two subjects we are studying at present: the roadmap and immigration.

Official languages are a subject about which the Minister is passionate.

We are listening, Minister. You have 10 to 12 minutes.

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Minister of Canadian Heritage]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Good morning, everyone. I hope you are all well; I am, myself. I will be pleased to answer all your questions.

First, before beginning my speech, I would like to introduce the two officials who are with me and who work with me. They are experts in the field. They will also be able to answer your questions afterward. They are Hubert Lussier, Assistant Deputy Minister for Citizenship, Heritage and Regions, and Jean-Pierre Gauthier, Director General of Official Languages.

I am going to start my testimony by reiterating my deep and sincere appreciation for the work this committee has done, and your continued proven commitment to strengthening and defending Canada's official languages.

I follow with great interest your conversations and discussions, generally speaking, about the famous roadmap and immigration in francophone minority communities. I am proud to be able to work closely with colleagues who share the same passion for Canada's official languages. I look forward to our ongoing conversation on these and other important issues.

English and French are at the heart of what we are and who we are. I am a proud Canadian, a proud Montrealer, and a proud francophone who grew up with both official languages. They are a part of my everyday life.

I am a champion for official languages in Canadian society. You can count on me to support the vitality of official language minority communities, because our official languages are a strength and an asset for our future, and have played a central role in our history.

Our country's foundations were built on English and French.

It is in these languages that we have welcomed people from all backgrounds.

Today, as Canadians, we participate in the political, democratic and social life of our nation in English and French. We are engaged internationally in those two languages, in the context of culture and business.

For all these reasons, I am proud to promote our two official languages, with the support of my parliamentary secretary, Randy Boissonnault.

I would like to talk to you about our official languages consultations, which will form the basis of the 2018-2023 Action Plan on Official Languages. First, however, I would like to take a few minutes to talk about the Annual Report on Official Languages 2014-15, which was tabled in July.

The report gives an overview of what my department, but also other federal institutions, is doing to promote official languages and the development of minority English- and French-speaking communities.

It provides information on subjects such as the support of francophone immigration in places where francophones are the minority, and support for artists in minority situations.

As the report shows, some work has been done, but more work remains.

I am proud to be a part of a government whose members, from coast to coast to coast, value our official languages. I have been working closely with my cabinet colleagues on a variety of issues, as we work towards strengthening our official languages.

For example, we know that immigration to minority language areas is critical to the future of these communities.

This is why I'm proud to work with my colleague, Minister McCallum, to launch

the Mobilité francophone program.

I look forward to seeing your committee's report on immigration and to working with you on this important issue.

I was also pleased to work with my colleague, the Minister of National Defence, Minister Sajjan, to reinstitute training in French at the Royal Military College at Saint-Jean-sur-Richelieu, near Montreal.

Most recently, our government honoured our commitment to appointing bilingual judges to the Supreme Court by nominating Justice Malcolm Rowe of Newfoundland and Labrador. It should be a great source of pride for us all to have heard Minister Wilson-Raybould and former prime minister Kim Campbell discuss the increasing interest being shown in the legal community to learn both official languages and the high level of official language competency shown by many Supreme Court applicants.

Under our leadership, we have ensured that the importance of Canada's official languages is placed at the heart of our most important institutions, and we are very proud of it.

This is a prime example of both the vision and action for official languages demonstrated by our government. I will continue to play an important leadership role alongside my colleagues.

We know there are still a number of challenges; for example, in the areas of community infrastructure, early childhood education and postsecondary training.

This brings me to the Cross-Canada Official Languages Consultations 2016. They generated a lot of interest and I am very happy about that. We received 5,000 responses online. By the time the consultations are over, we will have met with almost 350 people in 22 Canadian cities in the most open and transparent roundtable discussions ever.

Why do I stress the fact that our consultations have been so open and so transparent? You know that under the Official Languages Act, we are required to hold public consultations. However, in this case, we decided not to hold them by invitation only, and also to invite journalists and people from the general public, and to conduct a number of consultations online. That is what makes them so open and transparent.

To date, 21 of the 22 cities on our agenda have been visited. Several consultations have been broadcast on the Internet. Interested journalists attended the discussions and I am very satisfied that there has been good media coverage in several regions of Canada.

We are also going to have three meetings here in the greater national capital region, with various national representative organizations.

We wanted to have an open, frank and useful discussion, and that is what we did.

I personally led six round tables from coast to coast to coast, including one in St. John's, Newfoundland and Labrador, while I was there for the Conférence ministérielle sur la francophonie canadienne, as well as others in Victoria, B.C., and Iqaluit, Nunavut. My parliamentary secretary Randy Boissonnault and I were proud to be joined by various cabinet colleagues across the country, including ministers Bibeau, Goodale, Brison, Chagger, Hehr, and LeBlanc.

The participants identified important matters of interest, such as the vitality of official languages communities, increasing the rates of bilingualism among Canadians of all ages, and bringing anglophones and francophones close together. Let me quote some participants.

The director of the Quebec Anglophone Heritage Network told us, “The language of Canada is French; the language of Canada is English. Both of them. And I like to think that I can go to Vancouver and meet Francophones there that I can speak French with, and vice versa, across Canada, and speak English here.”

The Co-Chair of Dialogue New Brunswick said:

We forget we have many things in common. We share a history. We have accomplished things together. How can we get to know each other in such a way that we are not afraid, so that we are able to converse and discuss...?

The questions generated a lot of exchange of ideas, and the input that will guide us in developing the action plan for official languages was very useful.

As you know, the current roadmap will end on March 31, 2018. Our action plan will be in effect the following day. The support of minority communities and our two official languages will continue to guide our actions, in keeping with our values.

Our official languages are a strength, and I hope that all Canadians, whether they are francophones in Quebec or Anglophones elsewhere in Canada, whether they are Acadians, Fransaskois, Metis or people from other linguistic groups, will take an interest in our official languages. Together, I would like us to encourage all Canadians to become agents of change, citizens engaged in our great social contract, at the heart of which the two official languages are reflected.

I want to continue to work with you, the committee, and all our government's partners to promote English and French across Canada.

Thank you. I am prepared to answer all your questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you very much, Minister.

Without further delay, since we have only one hour together, we are going to move on immediately to the first round for comments and questions from members of the committee.

We will start with Mrs. Boucher.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Good morning, Minister. Good morning, Mr. Lussier and Mr. Gauthier. I am very happy to have this time with you.

I was the parliamentary secretary for official languages from 2006 to 2007, in a previous government, when Ms. Verner was the minister. I am pleased to see that it is a woman defending official languages again today.

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC]

Thank you.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

I think it is very appropriate to say it. We are starting from behind and we still have a lot of work to do. Our committee is working very well and I am very pleased with it.

Minister, I am going to get to the crux of the matter. At several meetings, many francophone organizations, particularly in the field of immigration, have told us that they have had money taken away from them and given to anglophone organizations that are handing the work of integrating francophone immigrants. I was somewhat surprised to see that this money was being taken away from francophone organizations and given to anglophone organizations, when francophone organizations in minority communities were already working very hard to integrate our immigrants.

Can you assure us, Minister, that this will not continue to happen? We are not trying to find out, here, what side of the House started taking the money away, but in any event, nothing, or very little, was said about it at the time. This may have been because we were admitting fewer immigrants. Given the large numbers of immigrants, can we get assurances that our francophone organizations will not be penalized, please?

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC]

Thank you, Mrs. Boucher. I very much appreciate that.

That is a very good question. This is a subject that I know is extremely important to ensure the vitality and survival of our minority language communities.

I am having ongoing discussions about this with the Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship, John McCallum. I wanted to make sure that we made some breakthroughs in that regard. Mr. McCallum and I were involved in the operation to bring 25,000 Syrian refugees to Canada in two months. We received a number of applications from organizations to have some of those refugees integrated in the minority language. That is why, with my colleague, I announced the resumption of the Francophone Significant Benefit program, which made it possible to integrate our various immigrants in French outside Quebec in a much more consistent way.

In the context of developing the Action Plan for Official Languages, obviously we want to address the question of immigration.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

I simply want assurance that francophone organizations will no longer be penalized. For one or two months, we have been hearing about money being taken away from organizations that were already helping francophone immigrants and given to anglophone organizations. I simply want assurance that our francophone organizations in minority communities will no longer be penalized in favour of anglophone organizations.

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC]

Thank you, Mrs. Boucher.

I am going to finish my answer, which actually had two parts. First, there is the restoration of the Francophone Significant Benefit program. Second, there is the fact that we have to work with the provinces. Unfortunately, we sometimes see that these decisions are actually made at the provincial level.

That being said, there have still been breakthroughs on this issue. At our Ministerial Conference on the Canadian Francophonie in St. John's, I had an opportunity to talk about the immigration issue.

In addition, my New Brunswick counterpart, Francine Landry, raised this question at the conference on immigration in Winnipeg a few weeks ago. We want to make sure that we work with the provinces. We want the money intended for integration in French to be actually spent by the provinces.

Of course, I want to work with Mr. McCallum to achieve the 4.4% francophone immigration target, which has not been achieved for years. That objective has been defined repeatedly, but, unfortunately, it has never been achieved, given past under-investment. At a time when we are developing new immigration thresholds, we want to be sure we reach 4.4% francophone immigration.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you very much.

We will now move on to Paul Lefebvre.

[Paul Lefebvre, Liberal, Sudbury, ON]

Good morning. Many thanks for being here. This is your second meeting with the committee. It is always an honour to have you here.

I also want to thank you for holding all these consultations during the year. I was very gratified to have you come to my riding, with the parliamentary secretary and Mr. Lussier, to discuss the issues facing minority communities and the vitality of those communities. This is an important issue for Canada and it is important to me as well.

In the numerous meetings you have had, what have you heard about the issues facing our minority communities and the vitality of those communities? How can the action plan you foresee support our francophone communities and ensure their survival?

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Lefebvre. That is a very good question.

First, I have informed my team that I was going to make sure the next action plan would include two major focuses.

The first focus will be to support the vitality of the linguistic communities. I am going to make sure that we build on a holistic approach, rather than the silo approach that was taken in the last roadmap.

The second focus will be bilingualism among the public. I do not see this as the two language groups being in competition. Both of them will contribute to maintaining healthy social cohesion in Canada, between the majority group and the minority group. They are also going to help to reaffirm the social contract I referred to in my presentation. At the very foundation of our country there is a social contract that includes our two official languages, the pluralism of our society and reconciliation with the aboriginal peoples.

Those are the two broad focuses that I want to make sure are addressed in developing the new action plan. Hubert Lussier and Jean-Pierre Gauthier are working on this.

During the public consultations, we heard four major themes.

First, there is immigration. Mrs. Boucher referred to this. It is a very important subject, because, ultimately, it is associated with the survival of our communities. I want to work with the provinces on this issue, to make sure that the federal leadership is transposed to the provincial level.

Another theme that came up often during the consultations is the need to have more funding for community and school infrastructure. I mentioned a little earlier that I had done several public consultations on official languages in several cities in Canada, but I have also gone to Saint Boniface, Halifax, and Whitehorse, where I took part in round tables with local people. I had an opportunity to see the infrastructure in question and I am aware that investments are needed.

The third theme relates to the media. The issue is how we can make sure that information generated within the communities is transmitted and contributes to the vitality of the community. This is an important question, particularly in the digital era. It should be noted that the other component of my ministerial responsibilities relates to culture and the media. The subject of media for minority language communities is therefore an important one.

The fourth and last theme is education, from early childhood to the postsecondary level.

Those are essentially the four broad themes that were raised in the consultations.

[Paul Lefebvre, Liberal, Sudbury, ON]

You visited us in Sudbury during the summer. What observations have you made across the country concerning community infrastructure, more specifically in francophone minority communities?

I believe there was a lot of investment in the 1960s and 1970s. Today, a lot of that infrastructure is in need of support.

What was your reaction when people asked you for answers about this?

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC]

I went to St. John's, Newfoundland and Labrador, where the francophone centre is the heart of the community. People come together there and work on projects. There is an abundance of ideas. Of course, the infrastructure in several places is in need of updating. The linguistic communities are interested in us being able to observe the changes in their vitality.

For example, I went to Iqaluit, in Nunavut, where there is a fine francophone community. The same is true in Whitehorse, in Yukon, where there are expansion projects for adding spaces for children and for various members of the community. That is also the way to ensure that children are comfortable and happy throughout their school careers, in community and school facilities that are of equal quality to the majority's facilities. That is fundamental.

It is also interesting to observe the first generation of Canadians born after the Official Languages Act, who have grown up under the influence of the public policies developed under that act. At present, those people are having children of their own, and their children are being integrated into the community. So we are seeing that the impact of the decisions we made as politicians is positive. However, we have to ensure that this leadership and these investments continue, and, to do that, infrastructure is a fundamental issue.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Choquette, you have the floor.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Thank you for being here today, Minister.

I would also like to thank Mr. Gauthier and Mr. Lussier for being here as well. We will be speaking shortly.

I have three or four questions. I need very short answers, because time is limited.

Ms. Joly, do you support the principle of “by and for francophones” in official language minority communities? I am asking for a yes or no answer to the question.

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC]

I think it is important to work with the various organizations and support their development. It is also fundamental to work with the provinces.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

A minute of my time is already over, unfortunately.

Do you support the idea of “by and for francophones”?

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC]

Mr. Choquette, the questions you are asking involve complex issues, and, as Minister, I think it is my responsibility to present all the aspects of a complex question.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

That is fine. We will move on to the second question.

You know we have had some problems with the RCMP recently and a report has been submitted on that subject. I have asked questions about it in the House of Commons. One of the recommendations in the report was to establish an oversight mechanism, by August 31, 2016, that could confirm that bilingual service is available at all times on Parliament Hill.

Can you get hold of the description of that oversight mechanism and provide it to the Committee, please? I have looked for it, but I have never found it.

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC]

I have had an opportunity to speak to my colleague the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, Ralph Goodale, concerning the RCMP. We operate horizontally when it comes to official languages, and we are very happy. We see that we have made progress on various issues.

On the question of official languages, I am very pleased with your leadership in that regard, Mr. Choquette, and I would remind you that leadership must be constantly reasserted, and that we can always do better. I am constantly frustrated and angry when I see that federal institutions, or various groups under federal jurisdiction, are not complying with the Official Languages Act. I am pleased to hear your questions, because they enable me to follow up on this issue.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Ms. Joly.

If you find the description of the oversight mechanism, please forward it to the committee.

My third question relates to the Translation Bureau. You have probably read the very fine unanimous report written by the committee. The titles of some news reports give us an idea: “Translation Bureau: government's response termed disappointing” and “Translation Bureau: changes called for are rejected.”

Minister, I know that this subject is the responsibility of Ms. Foote and not yourself. We have not been able to meet with Ms. Foote, unfortunately. We have introduced a motion for that purpose.

In the meantime, can you tell us what recommendations you consider to be very important in that report?

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC]

I am proud of Canada's expertise in translation. I am particularly proud of the fact that the federal government demonstrated leadership by creating the Translation Bureau.

I would note that Ms. Foote is responsible for the Translation Bureau. I also want to make sure that we preserve that expertise, in French, English, and the various aboriginal languages. We will be developing a policy on aboriginal languages. We must therefore make sure that we strengthen the Translation Bureau.

I also understand that the Translation Bureau responds to 80% of translation requests. We must therefore be sure that we have excellent interpreters who will be able to have a good career within the Translation Bureau. I have already said this to Ms. Foote and she completely agrees with me. We want to strengthen the Translation Bureau.

In addition, we want to be able to expand the range of services offered by the Translation Bureau. We know that various technological solutions are available and we want to be sure the Translation Bureau is able to use those various technological services to expand the type of services it offers.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

I have barely one minute left, Minister.

Everything relating to the Translation Bureau is extremely important to the committee. That is a unanimous report and we worked very hard on it. As you know, Mauril Bélanger and I brought that issue forward. I had worked on it for several months before going ahead. I hope you will speak again with Ms. Foote and tell her that perhaps her response needs to be revised. We—and I am not talking about myself, I am talking about the entire committee—will be very happy to meet with her so we can develop a better response regarding the Translation Bureau.

On the question of the justice...

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Ahuntsic-Cartierville, QC]

To conclude on that subject, I would add that Ms. Foote is a very competent minister who cares deeply about official languages. Rest assured that the subject of the Translation Bureau is one of her priorities.