Official Languages Committee on Feb. 7th, 2018

[Marie Hélène Eddie]

I haven't looked into that subject in particular, but I have seen some studies on the issue. The situations are in fact similar. The only real difference is that francophones are genuinely in the minority across Canada, whereas English Quebecers derive a certain strength from the fact that Canada is majority English.

I think the needs are very similar in a way because the broadcasters, Radio-Canada in particular, don't reach the anglophone or francophone communities living in the regions as much as one might think. That means it's up to the community radio stations and newspapers to play that role.

I am currently conducting a study on the content published in the English-language and French-language newspapers in the Atlantic provinces and the way they address issues such as bilingualism, linguistic duality, and French-language services. Radio-Canada clearly plays an essential role in the communities in those areas. However, I see that, in the Atlantic region, it is the little papers, such as L'Acadie Nouvelle, that constantly focus on those issues. I therefore think that the situation must be quite similar in Quebec in this regard. It should not be forgotten that the English-language community radio stations and newspapers also play a truly essential role in Quebec's rural regions.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

I believe that too because, unlike the communities in greater Montreal, those in the suburbs seem stifled. Like it or not, they do not exist. In fact, they exist solely thanks to the community newspapers and what is happening in those communities.

My next question is for Mr. Jolin.

Mr. Jolin, earlier you said that the government must invest in digital infrastructure and training. Can you tell us more precisely what you mean by those words?

[Carol Jolin]

We want to reach young people because we want them to get involved, but I get the impression it will be hard to interest them without cellphone apps. There is a loyal clientele for paper versions and radio broadcasts, and there is a youth clientele for anything that involves a cellphone. If we want to make this transition and actually bring young people on board, we have to go that route. From a community standpoint, we're talking about the digital shift, but many organizations still do not see it. They're still driving straight down the road. We know we have to make this transition. The intention and desire are there, but the resources needed to do it, the finances, expertise, and training, are not.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

You're thinking about apps. I would like to address certain aspects of your white paper. Recommendation 27, which concerns monitoring, reads as follows:

It is recommended that a neutral Observatory, comprising a board of directors and a small team and funded by the Government of Canada via Canadian Heritage, be created to ensure audience/readership measurement and the monitoring of the reinstatement of government advertising.

That's consistent with what you're saying today. I imagine linguistic minorities are evolving in a way. Some people prefer paper versions, but, as you say, young people are evolving.

How can we adapt to this reality?

I would like you to talk to us about this recommendation.

[Carol Jolin]

We must adapt and have an idea about what's happening. Community radio stations, unlike others, cannot afford Numeris surveys. They are very expensive, and it is very hard to determine how well they work.

It's quite easy for a print media business to show its circulation numbers. For media organizations such as radio stations, however, it's hard to determine how many people listen to programs and how many are prepared to take part in them. An organization that conducts a kind of monitoring could give us a very clear idea of those numbers and provide arguments. Then we could argue that many people listen to the programs and that the community revolves around the radio station. It's important for us to be able to do the work we have to do and to do it well. There's also the issue of the shift. That does not happen in isolation.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

This week, on Tuesday to be precise, some people who came to meet with us spoke to us about tax credits. That was mainly in connection with Canadian content, with journalism.

How do you view that?

[Carol Jolin]

Canadian content is clearly included in communications.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

If we're talking about local media organizations, whether it be radio or other media, what comes to mind?

[Carol Jolin]

It's regional news.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

I see.

[Carol Jolin]

There is provincial and international news and so on, but I think the primary mandate is to focus on the community. The community radio station I know best here in Ottawa is Unique FM. The news it provides is varied, but it's mainly news about the Outaouais.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you very much, Ms. Lapointe.

[Bryan Michaud]

I would like to go back to Ms. Lapointe's second last question on polling firms. Even if a media business wanted to invest in a survey, which really costs a lot of money, that would not necessarily help it since those firms are not adapted to minority communities. The survey results might not be as accurate as they would be in another context.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

We will now begin the second round. Time is passing, and, since four people want to speak—Mr. Samson, Mrs. Boucher, Mr. Vandal, and Mr. Généreux—we will limit ourselves to three minutes of speaking time.

You have three-minutes, Mr. Samson.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Imagine, he's giving me three minutes! So I'll have to limit myself to a few points.

As you said earlier, "equal" does not mean "equitable". You cannot compare—we spoke the other day—survival in a majority setting with survival in a minority community. It's a major problem.

If the francophone community media outside Quebec and the anglophone media in Quebec disappeared, do you think we would be heading toward assimilation?

[Carol Jolin]

We would be headed straight for assimilation because we would lose the community connection. Every month, I tear the community activities page out of L'Orléanais and post it on the refrigerator. My sons consult it because they know that, if there is something that might interest them, that's where they'll find it.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

You said something else that I find interesting.

You mentioned monitoring, surveys, and so on. You have to have data and an up-to-date picture. I would like to say "census", but the census is very complex with all its questions. I understand that Statistics Canada has other ways of gathering data than the census. We could establish a mechanism to gather data from certain key locations such as the media in order to understand the situation on the ground and determine whether we are heading toward assimilation. That's an interesting idea.

That being said, does the province allocate funding to assist the media? Could there be some joint federal-provincial funding? Has that previously been discussed?

[Carol Jolin]

As far as I know, there is no special media budget. We also speak with the provincial government to ensure that advertising will be restored in support of the francophone media. The province also has a responsibility for the quality of its francophone communities.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

I can tell you that, if we had Le Courrier de la Nouvelle-Écosse and the community radio station in Nova Scotia, we would not be heard across the province or the country because there would be no local francophone presence. Consequently, something is to be done.

I enjoyed your presentation today.

[Carol Jolin]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you.

Please go ahead, Mrs. Boucher.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Good evening.

Thank you for being here.

I'm going to ask you two very brief questions, and I want you to speak frankly.

I'm going to start with the words, "Erase everything and start over." What should we tell the leaders of all the political parties to make them understand that minority francophones and anglophones need to be heard? What does it take for them to shift into action?

That's a tough question, but I want you to be frank.

[Carol Jolin]

Are you asking me what we want from leaders?

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Yes.

[Carol Jolin]

I think an elected representative has a responsibility for official languages. To shoulder that responsibility he or she must address the vitality and development of the communities, and that depends on funding.

We talked about genuine equality. I see three little figures standing behind a fence. They are of three different sizes, each six inches shorter than the figure to its left. Only one can look over the fence and see the baseball game being played on the other side. Genuine equality means providing stools of different sizes so everybody can watch the game.